Need help / advice for this tank roulette situation

[ZedxKayn]

Yet the DPS are mostly (if not solely) the problem in general in DF groups, and likely the cause of healers and tanks coming with such an attitude.
If they behave properly and play their jobs right, I will truck through Steel Vigil to the boss in 8 minutes, Antitower in less than 9, and even Brayflox HM can be done in 4 massive pulls and in 6 minutes.

But no, many are not able to utilize their job right and things drag on at the expense of the healer and the tank. Because easier to notice when tanks/healers play bad, and the group risks a wipe if they die.

And the DPS? "Just" another 5-8 minutes extra wasted in the dungeon since they can't play their job like they supposed to. Or even more, when they don't evade AoE or instadeath mechanics.

We are tired of it.
Bring your damn A-game into the dungeon, DPS.

We will pull through them in record time if you do. Believe me. Everybody wins if you do.

Dude. Idk how any of this is related to what I'm saying but a DPS landing the first GCD on a pack is not going to make a run take longer. A tank letting people die over petty grievances will.

[Arrius]

Dude. Idk how any of this is related to what I'm saying but a DPS landing the first GCD on a pack is not going to make a run take longer. A tank letting people die over petty grievances will.

Proper tanks know where to go and how far they can pull. It's simple as that.

If it's a group I am pulling and you get the first GCD in for whatever reason, I won't give a second damn about it. Easy to pull them back onto me.
If it's a group they pull from across two corners and they think they know better, as a DPS, of what limits the TANK has, then they deserve to get their faces smashed in by that group.

But let's face it. That happens mostly to folks who are new to tanking and don't know the layouts of the dungeons and you shouldn't pressure them needlessly.
Or if the dungeon is new and the tanks need to get their feet wet of how the dungeon works.

I admit, though, there are some AIN tanks that got such a attitude regardless, but for one of such tanks, I can recall a dozen DPS who are just as bad.

So don't comb over all of us just because you have maybe one, perhaps two or three bad experiences with them in your whole playsessions combined.

[Ath192]

Dude. Idk how any of this is related to what I'm saying but a DPS landing the first GCD on a pack is not going to make a run take longer. A tank letting people die over petty grievances will.

A DPS escalating a situation and aggravating an irritated tank will make a run take longer. It’s crazy the lengths you will go to justify this stance. That’s not how normal people play this game. At least not in the 7 years I’ve played it. I get it’s easier to simply blame everyone else and never admit any faults but lacking consideration for your party members is a sign of a terrible player. So blaming the tank for a bad attitude when yours is equally as bad and uncompromising is just two sides of the same coin.

I’ll give you an example just now we had a tank running an expert slow as molasses and we told him to feel free to pull big, he did and one of the DPS died, the DPS said no big deal, let’s keep the big pulls coming, they’re fun. He continued to do double pulls but at a slower rate than you’d want him to but that’s okay, he sped up, and we slowed down.

And you know what happened? We had a decent run and never devolved into insults, and people quitting and you pull you tank stuff. People comm’d on the way out and that was it.

[ZedxKayn]

It’s crazy the lengths you will go to justify this stance. That’s not how normal people play this game.

All I said is that a DPS/healer pulling is not as harmful as a tank griefing.
Only one has the sole intent of letting a teammate die and ultimately hinder the run.
But if that statement is "reaching lengths" to you...

[IckeDerTyp]

Well, a tanks job is to pull and hold aggro on things that attack their party!

Some take it a little too serious, it's a game first and foremost, so don't worry about it too much!

Relax!

Also, if I basically wall yo wall as a tank and a silly nin still manages to get in front of me and pulls first, I'd love to 'you aggro, you tank' em but...

My duty is to protecc... What a Dilemma...

[Rinhi]

If they behave properly and play their jobs right, I will truck through Steel Vigil to the boss in 8 minutes, Antitower in less than 9, and even Brayflox HM can be done in 4 massive pulls and in 6 minutes.

But no, many are not able to utilize their job right and things drag on at the expense of the healer and the tank. Because easier to notice when tanks/healers play bad, and the group risks a wipe if they die.

stone vigil taking less time than antitower - wat.
it's not hard to notice if the DPS players are doing badly since your next sentence explains why, you just can't say anything about it because "people should be allowed to do content with the lowest amount of effort they could muster" even at the expense of 3 other players

And the DPS? "Just" another 5-8 minutes extra wasted in the dungeon since they can't play their job like they supposed to. Or even more, when they don't evade AoE or instadeath mechanics.

We are tired of it.
Bring your damn A-game into the dungeon, DPS.

We will pull through them in record time if you do. Believe me. Everybody wins with this.

hey, expecting DPS players to put in an effort is toxic according to this forum, you can't say that!

A DPS escalating a situation and aggravating an irritated tank will make a run take longer. It’s crazy the lengths you will go to justify this stance.

question: why is the hypothetical irritated tank playing a multiplayer game where things can go bad if they're upset already?
why are you absolving them from any blame by putting it firmly on a dps who may or may not have accidentally pulled another group of mobs - and when it wasn't an accident - pulled said mobs knowing the group can easily handle it? why is the person that is actively griefing the other 3 players and the run not to blame?
if the group can't handle it, sure, kick the dps who pulls, but anything else is ego wankery because "they're doing my job waaaah"

[Imora]

What you never had a healer go to the next pack and use rescue on you? It's fairly rare and there are times that it is a healer doing so to their tank friend who supposedly doesn't mind it. However there are also times when a healer doesn't care about a tank who might be rusty or unsure of their skills and feel like they're pulling too slow or whatnot and rescue the tank into the next pack.

Nothing like the idea of getting rescued into more mobs, then dying because you had no CDs and the healer was in brrrrr mode then getting blamed for the wipe.

I don't wall pull below 50. I get too many healers that can't keep me up or DPS that don't kill fast enough.

[Awha]

If a dps or healer are pulling for you then you are tanking wrong, as a tank they should not have the chance to pull extra.

I say this as a person that plays mostly tank and healers.

[Imora]

That doesn't always work at lower level when you've got a limited toolkit and say, two melee DPS with no aoe.

I usually judge it by the first couple pulls. Had a healer in Sastasha yesterday quit out of embarrassment. Got past the first boss and into the room you get captain's quarters key. I pulled first group, healer ran off to get more. I ran to grab aggro and the healer couldn't keep me up(rampart on cd) so we wiped. They're like "my bad" then went offline.

Had I actually had a cd for it we'd have been fine. Probably. :/. Sastasha is one I typically don't mass pull in because I get double melee a lot and lack of cooldowns with stuff dying slow is a recipe for disaster.

Once I get to 50 though I gauge healer on first pull then just go. I have trust issues with pug healers. Too many scholars that can't keep me up.

[Ath192]

question: why is the hypothetical irritated tank playing a multiplayer game where things can go bad if they're upset already?
why are you absolving them from any blame by putting it firmly on a dps who may or may not have accidentally pulled another group of mobs - and when it wasn't an accident - pulled said mobs knowing the group can easily handle it? why is the person that is actively griefing the other 3 players and the run not to blame?
if the group can't handle it, sure, kick the dps who pulls, but anything else is ego wankery because "they're doing my job waaaah"

Because angry people have been playing games for a the entire history of online multiplayer games. But this is a poor question regardless of the fact it ignores that reality because it can be applied to the DPS making it. See:


why is the hypothetical irritated DPS playing a multiplayer game where things can go bad if they're upset already?
why are you absolving them from any blame by putting it firmly on a Tank who may or may not pull multiple groups of mobs - and when he didn't pull wall to wall - pulled said quantity because he was unsure the group or he would be able to easily handle it? why is the person that is actively griefing the other 3 players and the run not to blame? (The DPS)
if the group can't convince the tank to go fast, sure, kick the Tank who refuses to compromise, but anything else is ego wankery because "I want this dungeon to go faster waaaah"

Like, there's just no reason not to communicate and work together in coop multiplayer game. None, whatsoever. This whole everyone has to do it like I say it oughta be just isn't helpful for a PvE MMO.