Zenos: The Big Bad (The Feedback Thread, Part 1)

[Vyrerus]

“he didn’t grow at all during the course”. Except he did gain the resonance, which is understood to grant at least some modicum of strength. So we start off getting absolutely pummeled, we get stronger, get pummeled again, get stronger, but then Zenos obtains the resonance so he also get stronger but the. we beat him. The power scaling is insanely wonky lmao.

He already had the Resonance the second time we fight him. He uses it when he unsheathes the Ame-no-Hibikiri.

[Crushnight]

My big issue with Zenos as a villain is he is just not entertaining since he has come back.

I don't care if a villain is sympathetic, deep or fitting for the narrative in the grand scheme of things. If I do not find them entertaining or want them on screen they are a bad villain to me.

Zenos as a character is simple on surface but deeper than a cursory glance will give you, but he failed on a basic level of being entertaining since his return that I just want rid of the man permanently and I actually liked Zenos in 4.0 which makes it feel worse that he has become so boring to watch.

[Cilia]

My big issue with Zenos as a villain is he is just not entertaining since he has come back.

He hasn't had much opportunity to be entertaining since his return; Varis, Emet-Selch, and Elidibus all superseded him as the preeminent threat we needed to deal with, while Zenos (and his new pal Danny Boy) have been in the background setting up what's to come in 6.0. 5.4 was mostly Vylbrand politics; 5.5 was more about freeing Tiamat than anything else, though Paglth'an did have us getting our feet wet against the Telophori.

[Crushnight]

He hasn't had much opportunity to be entertaining since his return; Varis, Emet-Selch, and Elidibus all superseded him as the preeminent threat we needed to deal with, while Zenos (and his new pal Danny Boy) have been in the background setting up what's to come in 6.0. 5.4 was mostly Vylbrand politics; 5.5 was more about freeing Tiamat than anything else, though Paglth'an did have us getting our feet wet against the Telophori.

I'd argue he has had ample time to be entertaining yet the subdued approach the writers took and dragging out that of having Zenos do anything has hurt him as a villain. I was bored of Zenos's journey to get his body back with the best part being cut out completely (Elidibus just fleeing offscreen) , the minor fight with Estinien and Gaius cut completely short before Zenos does a single attack (Zenos just defends with a shield and blocking Gaius's blade and grabbing Estinen's spear).

Zenos has not been entertaining for me since 4.0 , 6.0 can give him entertainment value back but he will forever be marred by what he was shown doing between 4.0 and 6.0.

[Erendis]

I did not mind Zenos much in 4.0, but after four years of him doing basically nothing I'm more than bored with him, I am sooo over him already. If he will actually become a "friendly" character (I doubt it but who knows with SE...) I don't know if I would be able to complete story...

[_Koneko_]

Zenos, Emet-Selc, Elidibus and Lahabrea will clearly become our BFF's in this expansion and join our trust system and then we'll go on a road trip to beat up the source of the sound

[Tracewood]

Still going with the idea that Zenos and the Scions will become uneasy allies and some kind of anti hero/rival that will return on occasion. He did mortally wound Y'shtola and I'd imagine she's not privvy to have such a psychopath in close range. Without an empire to rule, he'll be all about hunting sport. What if... he accompanies us during the 24 man raid? Hunting down the twelve if they somehow become manifested as super eikons? Or the Pandemonium raid? We know nothing of it yet unless day two of fanfest goes into more detail.

He could also get the Golbez treatment, though it would be a hard pill to swallow. Not sure how they'd pull that off. Going by his wiki he's been blood thirsty since he was a kid. Though guess if Vegeta gets a long redemption arc in another series anything can happen.

[Naria]

I'm late to this thread, but I have a similar problem with Zenos as I did with Lyse in Stormblood or Minfillia--we are getting told that this character has an interesting setup, but mostly on screen they just sit around and monologue.

I actually like his backstory, including his short stories. In the English version his voice actor is incredible. His character design is imposing. I don't need every antagonist to be sympathetic, and after Emet and Elidibus an opponent that you aren't suppose to sympathize with--who is just the villain-- could be a welcome change.

Despite all this Zenos has never felt threating to me. In Stormblood he didn't annihilate the Ala Mhigan resistance cell in Rhalgar's Reach despite having the perfect opportunity because it bored him. It doesn't matter how clever or skilled he is, he isn't a good leader and is perfectly willing to sabotage his own side on a whim. His threat level wasn't able to overcome Y'shtola's adamantine plot armor, and it would have probably been better if they had never had that scene because it created a Worf Effect for me. (insert standard warning about TV Tropes here)

He is eloquent but he isn't charismatic. People follow him either out of loyalty to the Empire or their own personal motivations, but he does not purposely engender loyalty from anyone. He doesn't bother to use his power as Crown Prince before Fandaniel gets involved because of how people bore him and how little use he sees in them, or any power beyond violence.

His desire to fight the WoL is very personal to him, but fighting him doesn't feel personal to me as a player. In contrast, by the confrontation with Elidibus in Amarout during 5.3 I was quite ready to punch him in the face.

Zenos doesn't feel like an actual person to me but like a very predictable ferry to take us to the final boss fight. It doesn't matter how much more powerful we are told he is than the WoL, he isn't going to do anything that would interfere with getting the fight he wants. Currently, there is no mystery to him in action, personality or motivation.

This can still change of course--we have a whole expansion of story to experience. Emet wasn't interesting to me in the lead up to Shadowbringers and that certainly changed. But as of right now, this is what I feel about Zenos.

[Vyrerus]

For me, Zenos is a character that grew on me the harder I looked at Stormblood to see what wasn't being said directly.

My initial reaction to him was, "This is bullshit!" because I didn't understand how a Garlean could be powerful enough to beat the WoL, especially after Thordan. After the Warring Bloody Triad, and their simulated maximums. It really made me delight in beating him down.

Y'shtola should have died in the scene where she risks her life for Lyse. With what they did in Shadowbringers, repeating her Heavensward arc wholesale, but with a Runar flourish really spoke to me, "They actually had nothing else they wanted to do with this character, but wouldn't dare risk the ire of the playerbase by killing her." (her exposition for the WoL's condition could have been done by Ryne, and it was actually rather obvious. Time would tell it to us anyway)

As for after 4.0, Zenos's out of body experience was rather delightful for me. I figured, due to my own assumption about the Echo, that he would be back, one way or the other, so when they honed in on doing just that I was delighted again. I didn't expect him to come back and be the new big bad, merely a bit player getting in ours or another villain's way. The devs had other ideas, obviously.

Whenever people complain that he's been boring and not doing a lot in the betwixt, I kind of laugh. However, I'm no longer laughing, because at this point it just seems like anyone who rattles off that tired old line is sticking to it without reason or self awareness. They did the same exact thing with the Ascians (but with less action). I guess more people are entertained by vague exposition, maniacal laughter, and brooding. This over poetry, action, and musings.

Though sometimes I also think I've over hyped myself on his character, and I will let myself down, come Endwalkers. We shall see.

[KizuyaKatogami]

He hasn't had much opportunity to be entertaining since his return; Varis, Emet-Selch, and Elidibus all superseded him as the preeminent threat we needed to deal with, while Zenos (and his new pal Danny Boy) have been in the background setting up what's to come in 6.0. 5.4 was mostly Vylbrand politics; 5.5 was more about freeing Tiamat than anything else, though Paglth'an did have us getting our feet wet against the Telophori.

He’s literally had 3 expansions now. He had sb to be a good villain. He had shb to be a good villain.Instead he’s done nothing but rid of things more interesting than him (Garlemald and Varis). Elidibus got two patches while Zenos gets 3 expansions. Yet he still just doesn’t feel like a good villain. Emet had one expansion and was able to shine amazingly well.