Final Fantasy XIV and a Culture of Enabling

[LianaThorne]

If the vote passes isn't that the will of the group? I get what you are saying if the vote does not pass then the person has a choice to make leave or deal with it. Though if it passes how is that in the wrong?

Difference of play style is has been a valid reason for removal. Silent kicks are often just that.

Does it pass because they actually want the person gone or because they just want the box out of their face and peer pressure?

And if they were common, like I said, you'd think I see one in the almost year I've been around. I havent once. First time I'm even hearing someone trying to defend a method of griefing as a valid means of removing a random person you're getting bothered by and will never see again after the dungeon ends.

[Awha]

Does it pass because they actually want the person gone or because they just want the box out of their face and peer pressure?

And if they were common, like I said, you'd think I see one in the almost year I've been around. I havent once.

I have never said they are common for everyone. They are common for me because I often kick people. Also your question as to why they pass is also irrelevant I cannot be certain what rational was used when a person clicked yes. All we can go based off was did the vote pass or not.

Standards are personal so clearly the threshold for removal differs from person to person that is why it is impossible to really know the thought process behind a silent kick. So it becomes in part a moot point.

[LianaThorne]

I have never said they are common for everyone. They are common for me because I often kick people. Also your question as to why they pass is also irrelevant I cannot be certain what rational was used when a person clicked yes. All we can go based off was did the vote pass or not.

What's actually irrelevant is this entire thread because SE isn't gonna do anything about this lmao. They purposely made the game to be inclusive to everyone. We're all just complaining and arguing to each other, meanwhile people are still gonna do the behavior some can or can't stand whether we like it or not. We all must be super bored.

[Awha]

What's actually irrelevant is this entire thread because SE isn't gonna do anything about this lmao. They purposely made the game to be inclusive to everyone. We're all just bitching to each other, meanwhile people are still gonna do the behavior ya'll can't stand whether you like it or not. We all must be super bored.

SE does not have to do anything about this since we have tools in place to take care of it ourselves. Though let us be real most threads on this forum are illrelavent. Part of the charm of our official forum.

[Vinupra-Rosa]

Does it pass because they actually want the person gone or because they just want the box out of their face and peer pressure?

In the quote below, the said person has said something that more or less is in line with your reasoning (peer pressure), outright encouraged taking advantage of it and this directly weakens his 'isn't it the will of the group?' assertion by like... a fair bit.

Sure I could be more patient and understanding but weird thing about the vote kick environment here, normally if the tank or healer start the kick one other person will always click yes. So why not use that to that your advantage.

My one suggestion is that if you guys are going to be ready to kick people for 'annoying you' with their 'poor performance' instead of actually attempting to at least stop and help then just go find your friends (if you have them) and do roulettes with them as a premade. As Liana above said, many of the things us 'vets' take for granted aren't immediately obvious to new players. They might misunderstand things, fail to comprehend something without help, or have come to wrong conclusions. It happens.

So when I go into Hero's Gauntlet and my Nin does his single target rotation(badly) on big pulls, and the Sum uses Ifrit and also doesn't aoe thats expecting to much?
Even after asking nicely they don't listen at all.
Some of you guys expectations are to low, thats a problem as well.

Now that's some hyperbole right there. Strawman? I'm pretty sure this is a logical/argumentative fallacy of some sort.

But several things -- expectations should rise and fall by content level and at 80, one is expected to at least know the basics, and that involves AoEs. Second, switching from ifrit to garuda and back to ifrit is honestly best taken as a bonus in casual content from DF; not everyone immediately knows what these pets are for, and it's certainly possible for one to reach level 80 without figuring out what is what in full without someone else to point it out for them[1]. Third, incidents like this are FAR from the norm - - having ran 80 content on the reg, I can't recall a single incident of both dpses being as horrible as you indicated. Fourth, this is a 2v2 (or 1v2) situation and that slightly reduces the chances of your votation going through which means you're probably best off bailing.

And there's a difference between 'never vote kick!' and 'please don't be careless with votekick'. You mentioned "Even after asking nicely they don't listen at all." and that already is in the territory of 'you tried'. Given that, if their refusal to heed advice continues to cause problems in the run then you may initiate a valid votation. This particular scenario you brought up isn't even the problem.

The problem is when people vote kick people out of the run without even bothering to offer consideration or help.

[1] There's no big red tootip going "GARUDA FOR AOE, IFRIT FOR SINGLE TARGET!" and yes, sometimes that measure is needed - - - and that's not a fault of the person itself. People's minds work differently. Some people are slower in things others are faster at, and vice versa.