Tired of Zenos (spoilers)

[MoofiaBossVal]

I like Zenos.

I'm tired of the mantra that "villains must be DEEP or complicated". I'm tired of the victimization of evil where villains have to have tragic backstories or be sympathetic.

I like Zenos... because he is unapologetically EVIL. He isn't fighting for some warped ideology. He isn't lashing out against the world. Zenos is just a bloodthirsty warrior who loves the thrill of living on the edge of death and that's it. He is refreshing in his simplicity.

I am fine if he turns out to be the final boss.


I think Zenos could have been more interesting if he hadn't spent the near entirety of the Shadowbringers patches lounging around in a chair.

To me, the appeal of Zenos is that he is a self made man. Everything he does is in pursuit of self-glorification, of becoming the very very strongest warrior in the history of ever. Zenos is at his most interesting when he is pursuing that goal. Like during the Stormblood patches, when he found himself in another body, and started bodyhopping up the chain, and was going on a journey to go confront Elidibus and fight himself. That was exciting. I also liked the Zenos short story, about how a swordmaster from Corvos became Zenos' teacher and kicked Zenos in the ass, so Zenos had to actually get better. He searched the libraries for lore on the sword style, and invented a new technique to try to overcome that swordsmaster. It reminds me of Archaon from Warhammer Fantasy, who was also the big bad of that franchise, but he was also the hero of his own story, going on his journey overcoming trials, gathering allies, and acquiring magical artifacts to prepare for the final battle against Sigmar.

After Zenos got his body back, he should have been trying to pursue the WoL to the First to fight him, or he should have been going off to fight big challenges like Tiamat or Hydaelyn or something until the WoL got back. I think the reason why he didn't do that is because the writers didn't want to detract from the story going on over on the First, but it's still disappointing that he was just sitting around waiting for the WoL to get back.

Zenos is the Sylvanas of FFXIV

Oh, goodness gracious no! I understand why people don't like Zenos, but comparing him to Suevanas?

Say what you will about Stormblood, but I can't imagine FFXIV's writing quality ever reaching WoW levels.

[Jeeqbit]

I really like Zenos, but if someone who has an expansion dedicated to them is going to die then they should be dead for good.

But I think the reason they've done it is to tell a greater story about immortality and its nature and that's the real story here. We need to see past Zenos and look at this greater story they are trying to tell about an immortal being.

[HyperiusUltima]

Zenos in particular is motivated by pure bloodshed. Always finding the 'thrill of the hunt' enjoyable - ever stronger opponents. The moment he laid eyes on the WoL, he had found a quarry that would give him a challenge. We saw this all the way through Stormblood - up to 4.55. Reminder: He was dead up til' 5.2. Considering he sparked the civil war for succession(AGAIN, because they got done with one around the time of HW), the screen of Garlemald and that tower that Fandaniel has tells us a lot - he leveled the damn place. Zenos grows tired of this world, and would rather see it ravaged in the name of having the chance to fight the Warrior of Light once more - and considering he BREAKS Ame-no-Habakiri with just his FOOT - SNAP - in 5.4, we're probably going to see more of him in 5.5 to give foretelling like how Fandaniel did at the end of 5.4.

[Kyrj]

It kind of annoys me how SE won't commit to killing a character. This is an issue in most MMORPGs but yeah. He was good in Stormblood as a reminder that even with our gifts we were still lacking, we overcame that power gap and beat him. That should've been it but nope they had to literally pull a Sylvanas and rez Zenos after he took his own life.

SE is really bad in this area. Y'shtola, Thancred, Minfillia. Just gonna call it now and in Endwalker Papalymo comes out and Fing Zettaflares Zenos in his face.

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

It kind of annoys me how SE won't commit to killing a character. This is an issue in most MMORPGs but yeah. He was good in Stormblood as a reminder that even with our gifts we were still lacking, we overcame that power gap and beat him. That should've been it but nope they had to literally pull a Sylvanas and rez Zenos after he took his own life.

SE is really bad in this area. Y'shtola, Thancred, Minfillia. Just gonna call it now and in Endwalker Papalymo comes out and Fing Zettaflares Zenos in his face.

Well if characters dont die, then they still serve a purpose in the narrative. A good handful of character have died and stayed dead. I agree the amount of fake deaths is abit annoying
But...if Papalymo comes back I will be upset. Its Lyse/Yda now...but Papalymo imo is the weakest Scion

[MarsAstro]

I didn't really like Zenos much either, I thought he had a nice introduction and a fitting end, but was overall kind of bland and boring as a villain.

However, I used to think Ascians were the most generic and boring villains of all time too, but after Shadowbringers they've become one of my favorite parts of the game. Then there are characters such as Yotsuyu, Gosetsu and Gaius, whose return gave their characters more depth.

So, I have a faith that Zenos has a pretty good chance of having a good role in Endwalker. The writers have shown that they can take something boring and uninteresting, and make it great, so I believe they can do it again. I also don't really believe they'll go for the obvious plot line. I don't think Zenos will just be the main villain again, and end up as a last boss where he's somehow possessed Zodiark like he did Shinryu. It's too obvious, and I doubt the writers will go for such a plain and cliche route.

Honestly, I don't even think they'll go for the "Zodiark bad, Hydaelyn good" route, because Shadowbringers has shown that it's not that simple. I'm expecting that at the end of Endwalker, either both or neither of them are gone. Some kind of balance will be achieved, probably.

[Kikoten]

Zenos? The Sylvanas of FFXIV? They're hardly comparable. I feel that these comparisons are just being used as an insult; Sylvanas has become an unpopular character in the Warcraft universe who vastly overstayed her welcome. Zenos has not been around nearly as long as Sylvanas. And Sylvanas ultimately suffers from bad writing. Sure, it can be argued that Zenos, too, suffers from bad writing, but let's face it, SE knows what they want to do with Zenos, and Blizzard keeps Sylvanas around for reasons I can only guess. Certainly not to tell a good story. Sylvanas' story ended in Wrath of the Lich King. That was it. She re-lived to kill Arthas. Done.

[Stanelis]

Zenos is typical shonen bad guy, I also find him very boring and especially after Yotsuyu or Emet Sech.

[Bhearil]

It kind of annoys me how SE won't commit to killing a character. This is an issue in most MMORPGs but yeah. He was good in Stormblood as a reminder that even with our gifts we were still lacking, we overcame that power gap and beat him.

Remember that Yoshi P stated that the WoL defeating Zenos was basicaly a miracle. By now the Wol is clearly stronger than Zenos in SB but i doubt he didnt get stronger with the resonance power ups that made Elidibus abandon his body before fighting Zenos seriously, despite that Elidibus in Zenos body was confident he could take the Wol on if he really wanted.

Only after ShB expansion (with the implicit Wol power up) he had to get really serious to beat the Wol and only was defeated due to the Ascian crystals + Graha Tia trapping his soul forever in the Crystal tower, it would have been a complete stomp in his favour otherwise

[TheMightyMollusk]

and Blizzard keeps Sylvanas around for reasons I can only guess.

She has a very, very loud fanbase. She's narrative cancer, but enough people love her that they keep her around anyway.