Thank you for returning to "original stories" for Raids in Endwalker

[Ultimatecalibur]

Eden being my least favorite set of trials asside from 2 or 3

I'd say Eden suffered more for 6 of the 12 fights being remix trials of the Primals (and Cloud of Darkness) that we already defeated back in ARR.

[Jirah]

I'd say Eden suffered more for 6 of the 12 fights being remix trials of the Primals (and Cloud of Darkness) that we already defeated back in ARR.

Eden 1 was amazing, Voidwalker was unque...slowed to a crawl after that until E7 which i didnt enjoy very much, and E11/12 were predictably good. even disregarding my distaste of trial raids, eden was underwhelming and most of them not nearly being as expansive as coils or over the top as omega

[GoldStarz]

I agree....to some extent.

some of the ideas weave into the plot pretty decently and come off as endearing rather than a pointless reference like the Warring triad, but some are just pointless like most of Omega where it was just back-to-back references and at the time it was good since some of the trials were unqiue enough (using the Phantom trains entirety as a dungeon like raid was a missed opportunity) and worst of all Neir being a cross over that hogged a entire expansions worth of raid content. I dont mind stuff like that like Monster hunter and Yokai pulled it off. but ff14 should focus on its OWN lore rather than just milking its franchise cannon. Eden being my least favorite set of trials asside from 2 or 3

Eden is a raid and is also almost completely original. It draws from FF8 as inspiration, but rarely ever dives into anything straight up referential like Omega.

[Jirah]

Eden is a raid and is also almost completely original. It draws from FF8 as inspiration, but rarely ever dives into anything straight up referential like Omega.

agree to disagree even if we ignore the fights they were still not as fun as Omega...with the only boring one being omega 1. Fun trials are still fun

[Bright-Flower]

I think I like Eden more than Omega because while a lot of the fights are primal reimaginings, they don't feel pointless where as the whole Omega plot kind of felt pointless until after Alphascape. A big old 'prove yourself fighting these references to older games' without really doing much. But part of that has a lot to do with not really being invested in Omega's universal tournament arc thing.


That said I like the FIGHTS in Omega I just really didn't care about the story until the latter half of Alphascape.

In Omega it's nine consecutive fights of fanservice bosses that don't tie into FFXIV's lore in any meaningful way. These bosses could be literally anything and still fit just as well. In Eden, the primal reimaginings have a reason specifically to be there, if slightly contrived, and contribute to the goal of restoring the elements to the Empty in a way that for me at least, was a lot more interesting than just seeing what crazy record from another world Omega's going to throw at us next.

[Jirah]

I think I like Eden more than Omega because while a lot of the fights are primal reimaginings, they don't feel pointless where as the whole Omega plot kind of felt pointless until after Alphascape. A big old 'prove yourself fighting these references to older games' without really doing much. But part of that has a lot to do with not really being invested in Omega's universal tournament arc thing.


That said I like the FIGHTS in Omega I just really didn't care about the story until the latter half of Alphascape.

In Omega it's nine consecutive fights of fanservice bosses that don't tie into FFXIV's lore in any meaningful way. These bosses could be literally anything and still fit just as well. In Eden, the primal reimaginings have a reason specifically to be there, if slightly contrived, and contribute to the goal of restoring the elements to the Empty in a way that for me at least, was a lot more interesting than just seeing what crazy record from another world Omega's going to throw at us next.

Each trial felt unique in Omega. Catatrpohe gravity thing, the frog lady thing, Phantom train ghost, Copy Warmech, Chaddernuck painting, Graven image, ect while Eden was just trial fodder up for most of it maybe besides like a few stand outs but even then 6 of them were just trials of older trials while every fight in omega was unque

also lets not argue about "consecutive fights" as thats the whole Raid to blame. Eden had the same exact formula just without the added flare of Omega. Eden had context but lost a huge blow to its imagination and the story teetered back and forth and maybe wouldve benefited if it had a few more quests to build context.

[Cilia]

Omega was... OK, but a bit too heavy with rips from other games for shaky reasons (they're just myths and stories, some not even from this world, we swear!). The story was also rather predictable, with Omega's lack of a heart / soul obviously being the reason it can't overcome us as early as the first tier. Constantly talking about how its worldview is purely logical and data-driven makes that... plain.

I greatly enjoyed the Eden story and fights both. While some people might not like reusing the OG 6 elemental primals, I enjoyed the remixed fights, songs, and designs; Garuda / Ifrit and Shiva threw enough curveballs to keep my interest, and the background story was OK until it came to the forefront in the final tier. Mysteries keep me interested, and the ones posed in the Eden story were... good enough. (Helps that VIII is my first experience with the franchise, so that game has a special place in my heart. I acknowledge its faults and understand why some people don't like it though.)

A general issue that seems to plague this game's stories is they don't really get moving until the final act. The first two tiers really just set up the third, which is the big payoff; while that's a good way to keep players invested in the story, it's also not the greatest storytelling style (IMO) and when it gets predictable like this...

[Vyrerus]

Personally, the only thing I disliked about the Omega raid tier was that the normal mode fights left out the real final boss mode from each boss. While this made Savage all the more worthwhile for me, it still fell short of seeing that Louisoix fmv or whatever, that they had to release later on Youtube so that regular players could see it too. I would have rather had Neo Exdeath normal, God Kefka normal, and Final Omega normal so that more players could share in that experience.

As far as the fights go, someone said they could have been anything. Well, yeah. So could the fights of Eden. It just so happened that part of Shadowbringers was the dev team wanting to essentially remaster old content, since they were now masters of the game's development kit. I loved the reimagined primals, almost as much as I loved the early Final Fantasy references in all of the Omegascapes.

All in all, Omega raids had a better supporting cast by having the entire Ironworks and their affiliates present for the going ons. Eden raids, while having three "main" cast members for 2/3rds of the events kinda fell apart in terms of standing on its own, while contributing to the greater story of the game. Basically, without the involvement of Ascians and the Gaia twist and all that emotion and such, there's not a lot to it, whereas in Omega we have Cid and Nero teamed up creating tech that actually helps you in the fights. Biggs and Wedge too. Then there's Midgardsormr's backstory wrapped up with Omega's, and the entire raid tier introduced the new minor character, Alpha.

While Omega may have had a predictable conclusion, the journey wasn't all that predictable. There were acts between tiers where Omega enforced its presence and threat, directly to the player character even. It left me wanting more, and I was glad to hear of Alpha and the Ironworks in the alternate future's dystopia. I also loved the flourish with the final tier being the Alphascape. Whereas in the first two tiers we were the challengers, in Alphascape we are the challenged, with Omega doing everything it can to defeat us.

With Eden, after it was done... I just felt like, "Hey, yeah, how about you go ahead and tell me the rest of the Ascian's ancient story? That's what I want to know about. Gaia's transcendental nature and the now is all that matters... ehh, meh."

[Jandor]

I think Omega feels ok partially because of where we are now.

I remember hating how much blatant fanservice was in it as it was releasing, but they pulled it back a tad at the end while Ivalice went a bit off the deep-end, and then in ShB they just straight up dropped Nier into the game with (so far) no explanation.

Omega raids looking like well integrated XIV lore in retrospect.

[Bright-Flower]

Each trial felt unique in Omega. Catatrpohe gravity thing, the frog lady thing, Phantom train ghost, Copy Warmech, Chaddernuck painting, Graven image, ect while Eden was just trial fodder up for most of it maybe besides like a few stand outs but even then 6 of them were just trials of older trials while every fight in omega was unque

also lets not argue about "consecutive fights" as thats the whole Raid to blame. Eden had the same exact formula just without the added flare of Omega. Eden had context but lost a huge blow to its imagination and the story teetered back and forth and maybe wouldve benefited if it had a few more quests to build context.

The actual fights in Omega were fun. My complaint with Omega is purely in terms of the story and lore around the bosses, not the fight mechanics. The fights themselves were fun and unique. I feel a little confused here because you start by pointing out mechanics that made the omega fights unique, but then start talking about how the primals aren't unique? They had new mechanics, new visual designs, new music. They weren't just updated versions of the old fights like the unreal trials they've been doing. My issue isn't with the boss models or mechanics of the Omega fights though it's with the story and how they were integrated into the lore. Delta and Sigmascape just felt like excuse plots to throw fanservice bosses at us with no rhyme or reason. Where as the primals in Eden felt better justified, fighting the primals representing each element as we restore it to the Empty and seeing that progress a we go.