I Hope SE Learned Their Lesson From Eureka And Bozja

[Alaray]

I prefer Bozja/Eureka over the HW method, tbh.

I'll agree that they probably shouldn't have required Castrum and DR, without informing the playerbase prior. But I do think Castrum/DR ought to be the premier methods to advance the relic steps, above to doing LoTA ten minute runs.

Stuff like Castrum/DR'll last so long as there's incentives for it to last. Baldesion Arsenal is still done, to this day, mostly just for the Ozma mount and partly for the cosmetic drops inside.

They can make the most fun fight in the game, but ultimately, if there's no incentive no one will do it. Castrum struggling to fill has more of an issue with its rewards vs. it's risks (20 coins and some actions vs. potentially 20-40k mettle loss pending how frequently someone dies).

That said, Castrum fights aren't that hard relative to even other 24 man fights baseline. Some minor coordination, and 1 group functional enough to do the Lyon portion of the final fight... but mechanically speaking, they're... about the same as most 24 mans. Just with the added benefit of being able to make them easier via Lost Actions.

DR itself isn't really that rough, either. Mechanics in there are pretty intuitive to figure out, and again, Lost Actions make it all the easier.

Doom can be rough I spose, but tbh, pop on a re-raiser if you need to and have someone carry around Lost Arise. But ultimately, aside from a minor mettle loss, dying there isn't that big of a deal (and if you have 0 intention to do it again, then the mettle you lose in there, at that point, literally doesn't matter).

I agree with decoupling the mandatory aspect, but I disagree with removing Exploratory Content entirely from a relic grind, especially if it's done alongside a more traditional HW-style.

I much prefer Bozja than outdated fates.

[Daeriion_Aeradiir]

I'll agree that they probably shouldn't have required Castrum and DR, without informing the playerbase prior. But I do think Castrum/DR ought to be the premier methods to advance the relic steps, above to doing LoTA ten minute runs.

They did though, literal months ago.

"Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal
2 upgrade steps and you can customize the substats during the 2nd upgrade" ~ Yoshi-P, 11/27/2020, liveletter from the producer LXI.

The Bozja story includes castrum; they gave extremely advanced warning to go get Castrum done.

I do agree however Bozja should have been the premier choice for advancing the relic.

[TaleraRistain]

They did though, literal months ago.

"Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal
2 upgrade steps and you can customize the substats during the 2nd upgrade" ~ Yoshi-P, 11/27/2020, liveletter from the producer LXI.

The Bozja story includes castrum; they gave extremely advanced warning to go get Castrum done.

Problem is their English audience has to rely on unofficial translations of those Live Letters and you can find five or six different answers with no official statement for the English audience to go by. I went looking a few days before patch and still couldn't find anything definitive, just various suppositions from different sites. They really need to make sure we get official statements on this sort of thing. Especially because they have seen (or should have unless they're just outright ignoring us) the confusion and questions over the past few months and did nothing to definitively clarify.

[Daeriion_Aeradiir]

Problem is their English audience has to rely on unofficial translations of those Live Letters and you can find five or six different answers with no official statement for the English audience to go by. I went looking a few days before patch and still couldn't find anything definitive, just various suppositions from different sites. They really need to make sure we get official statements on this sort of thing. Especially because they have seen (or should have unless they're just outright ignoring us) the confusion and questions over the past few months and did nothing to definitively clarify.

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...812-06-2020%29

They put up official digest translations of their liveletters in a very official manner. Even in this digest, they reference this:

"The normal version of Delubrum Reginae will be required to complete story quests, and is similar to alliance raids in terms of difficulty."
"Players can upgrade their weapon after completing all 5.45 quests."

Considering the liveletter talks about new story quests in Bozja....it's impossible to interpret it any other way.

Even beyond that, the reddit discord has extremely powerful translators that not only do live translating, but also go back and solidify the translations later to clear up any doubt. bozja's story being required to progress the relic has been telegraphed for literal months now, both in an official and non-official manner. Anyone needing to have information cleared up has both an official source and non-official source both saying the same thing in 95% of cases.

[TaleraRistain]

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...812-06-2020%29

They put up official digest translations of their liveletters in a very official manner. Even in this digest, they reference this:

"The normal version of Delubrum Reginae will be required to complete story quests, and is similar to alliance raids in terms of difficulty."
"Players can upgrade their weapon after completing all 5.45 quests."

Considering the liveletter talks about new story quests in Bozja....it's impossible to interpret it any other way.

Even beyond that, the reddit discord has extremely powerful translators that not only do live translating, but also go back and solidify the translations later to clear up any doubt. bozja's story being required to progress the relic has been telegraphed for literal months now, both in an official and non-official manner. Anyone needing to have information cleared up has both an official source and non-official source both saying the same thing in 95% of cases.

That only mentions the story, though. That doesn't say anything about the story being required for resistance weapons, like where you linked. The first quest we get outside that zone. That's the problem I think. I definitely saw a lot of confusion where people asked "Is the Bozja story going to be required now?" and similar. The second sentence could be interpreted that you could get your upgrades in Bozja once you finished that story and you wouldn't see them there until you did if you got them in Bozja.

I think if they had used the terminology from your other posts ""Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal" then that would have cleared up a lot of confusion. People would still be angry, but not feel they hadn't been informed properly on top of the change.

[Vahlnir]

That only mentions the story, though. That doesn't say anything about the story being required for resistance weapons, like where you linked. The first quest we get outside that zone. That's the problem I think. I definitely saw a lot of confusion where people asked "Is the Bozja story going to be required now?" and similar. The second sentence could be interpreted that you could get your upgrades in Bozja once you finished that story and you wouldn't see them there until you did if you got them in Bozja.

I think if they had used the terminology from your other posts ""Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal" then that would have cleared up a lot of confusion. People would still be angry, but not feel they hadn't been informed properly on top of the change.

Yeah, they weren't very clear. Communication hasn't always been their strong suit though, at least outside of Japan. There are also times when the player base is pretty vocal about wanting something, then when Yoshi P is asked about it he seems genuinely surprised. I think a lot of feedback and requests just don't reach him.

[TaleraRistain]

Yeah, they weren't very clear. Communication hasn't always been their strong suit though, at least outside of Japan. There are also times when the player base is pretty vocal about wanting something, then when Yoshi P is asked about it he seems genuinely surprised. I think a lot of feedback and requests just don't reach him.

Packetdancer made an excellent point in another thread that the wording they used made the story in Bozja seem like an optional side-quest to unlock upgrading the resistance weapons there. Not that the resistance weapon itself required the story. And that those who didn't do the story wouldn't realize that because it's the story that makes that clear, not the way it was communicated.

I think you're right on the idea that things don't reach Yoshi-P but there should be folks before him who do get feedback and requests and if they're not doing their part, maybe someone higher up needs to look into that.

[wereotter]

They did though, literal months ago.

"Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal
2 upgrade steps and you can customize the substats during the 2nd upgrade" ~ Yoshi-P, 11/27/2020, liveletter from the producer LXI.

The Bozja story includes castrum; they gave extremely advanced warning to go get Castrum done.

I do agree however Bozja should have been the premier choice for advancing the relic.

The problem with this argument is that you knew you had to do it because you did it. If you went off the only translations we get for a lot of this, you could have been left in the dark. We were told the weapon could be completed outside of the exploratory zones, and after we completed the first trial, everything else could be done elsewhere. It caught a lot of people off guard to learn that now they had to get to rank 10 in the exporatory zone and complete 2 24-man raids before they could even start on the next step. It was not telegraphed well, and the translations we recieved gave no indication that you'd still have to advance in the zone even if you did your entire weapon elsewhere.

Additionally, I feel like forcing people to advance the exploratory zone in order complete the weapon runs counter to the concept of the relic, which had previously been something you could work on solo, even just with just an hour a day. Now you have to spend extra time in another zone to do additional content to just get to the quests, and have to do it in a scenario where you're unable to use duty finder to progress. When I'm in game, I don't want to try to type to talk to people. It's inconvenient on PlayStation, and I don't want to be chatty with other players.

So while I do think that the exploratory zone being popular with those who enjoy that kind of content should still be an option for the relic, it shouldn't be mandatory. Giving people options was a very good choice, but it just feels like a betrayal to be told that now you must go do content you didn't enjoy if you want the weapon.

Edit: with regard to your other link, this still wasn't "literally months ago" that post was from December 20, and is one line only that, unfortunately, wasn't broadcast out there the same way as the message of "you can do this outside of Bojza" was. But even if you did catch that, it only gave you a couple weeks to get ready, not months.

[Rymi64]

I prefer Bozja/Eureka over the HW method, tbh.

I'll agree that they probably shouldn't have required Castrum and DR, without informing the playerbase prior. But I do think Castrum/DR ought to be the premier methods to advance the relic steps, above to doing LoTA ten minute runs.

They actually did tell us DR would be required in the last LL and the one before that i believe