Why is the Manipulation skill locked behind the crafting quests?

[Eien713]

On the other hand the quests give sizeable exp boosts too. Up to and including HW you can buy the required items from the MB if you're feeling lazy, and starting from StB the items are dead easy to craft anyway. If you skip all the cutscenes they don't take too much time either.

I did almost just this since I was in a hurry, and it still took a considerable amount of time (>_<).

[Liam_Harper]

This is a side effect of handing crafters over on a plate to people who don't even like crafting. People have become so used to having everything just given to them that when something takes effort they start demanding it be handed over or become outraged.

I guess they might as well really. The class quests are just a final relic from when crafters were actually worth bothering with and don't really fit with the new turbo-to-80 and get-easy-items playstyle.

[SomeRandomHuman]

Unfortunately there no polite way to say this: Suck it up and just do it. Next thing is you'll complain about GP regen buffs being gated behind quests.

I leveled every crafter to max back in ARR when they were fairly complicated to level due to the materials being more expensive. What did I do? I started leveling my botanist and miner after I slogged through goldsmith and spent way more gil than I was comfortable with.

If it takes "too much time" then set smaller short-term goals like getting 1 or 2 levels in each day. Look up what the quests require beforehand and see if you can't get ahead of them(pre-SB at least.) If it's still too much then level your gatherers first so you can get what you need without the MB. The more time you have to moan here on the forums the more time you could've spent working on them.

[Eien713]

This is a side effect of handing crafters over on a plate to people who don't even like crafting. People have become so used to having everything just given to them that when something takes effort they start demanding it be handed over or become outraged.

I guess they might as well really. The class quests are just a final relic from when crafters were actually worth bothering with and don't really fit with the new turbo-to-80 and get-easy-items playstyle.

Boy, this community sure likes making assumptions and acting all high and mighty. The devs literally changed things so that you get all the other skills based on level. Why make this one any different? And what's so wrong about wanting to get something that mostly wastes time out of the way so that people can spend their time on more important things when it comes to crafting? It's not about wanting things handed on a plate (like I said 1000 times, the quests are boring as hell)--it's about wanting to focus on more important things.

[Eien713]

Next thing is you'll complain about GP regen buffs being gated behind quests.

Again with assumptions...

I leveled every crafter to max back in ARR when they were fairly complicated to level due to the materials being more expensive. What did I do? I started leveling my botanist and miner after I slogged through goldsmith and spent way more gil than I was comfortable with.

If it takes "too much time" then set smaller short-term goals like getting 1 or 2 levels in each day. Look up what the quests require beforehand and see if you can't get ahead of them(pre-SB at least.) If it's still too much then level your gatherers first so you can get what you need without the MB. The more time you have to moan here on the forums the more time you could've spent working on them.

I also leveled my crafters and MIN back in ARR and start of HW. I slaved through it all, fair and square. I'm not one to ask for things to be handed on a plate either. But it's just odd that this one skill was the only one that was still gated behind quests. Either give them all or give nothing. I wouldn't have cared about keeping all the skills gated behind quests.

[Vickii]

Boy, this community sure likes making assumptions and acting all high and mighty. The devs literally changed things so that you get all the other skills based on level. Why make this one any different? And what's so wrong about wanting to get something that mostly wastes time out of the way so that people can spend their time on more important things when it comes to crafting? It's not about wanting things handed on a plate (like I said 1000 times, the quests are boring as hell)--it's about wanting to focus on more important things.

This is a purely optional skill though. Yes I can’t see how you’re going to do the expert craft without it and perhaps it’s needed for some of the high 80 stuff but the rest of the game I don’t think it’s required. Makers mend can usually replace it for a similar cost.

I think just generally it’s assumed that the crafters doing the really high end stuff are going to have done their job quests. Otherwise you’re essentially giving the best things crafters offer for minimal effort.. I mean you can literally buy your way to 80 with Gil and probably never have to craft an item which is why you get a bit of negativity when this stuff is brought up.

It is a bit confusing if you say they removed all the other job quest skills and left this one in though. Perhaps it will get changed in the next expansion.

[Eien713]

This is a purely optional skill though. Yes I can’t see how you’re going to do the expert craft without it and perhaps it’s needed for some of the high 80 stuff but the rest of the game I don’t think it’s required. Makers mend can usually replace it for a similar cost.

Exactly. Last time, I gave up because I didn't have the crafted gear and the prices were so over the top and I wasn't willing to spend that much money on it. I thought it was hopeless for me to craft these recipes without this melded gear. But this time, I wanted to challenge myself by trying the expert recipes. I watched many videos and read guides. I saw a video of someone who made the expert recipe with max collectability using only the scrips gear (which is what I have). This gave me hope (though I'm not aiming for max collectability, mind you). I figured I'd go for a different job than last time too and chose one in which I thought I miiiight have a chance at a good ranking. But then I discovered the whole thing with Manipulation and despaired. I still "sucked it up" (like SomeRandomHuman kindly said), and did all the quests till I got the skill. It was such a tedious grind that I found was nothing but a waste of time. This is my opinion about all the crafting and mining quests because they're legit the only ones I don't have the faintest memory of after finishing them (compared to the DoW and DoM quests).

Edited to add that the main reason I gave up on the other crafters' quests is because of how boring I found the ones I had done. Also, I did the required quests back then to get all the useful cross skills, so I'm not a lazy person. The devs changing things later and messing up my work was aggravating. I remember I had Manipulation for LTW and GSM (as they're my main crafters), but then with the change, I had to go back to the tedious quests yet again to get it back for both of them (correct me if I'm wrong). I had already done my work once. Why force me to do it a second time?

[Quintessa]

I believe the idea was to discourage or reduce the need to macro synths, but I think the team forget that you can't level one craft and not fall into the crafting trap where you need to level all the rest.

[Kuroka]

Its already way too easy... the SB change for quests turned it into a piece of cake...

[Eien713]

What I don't get is why people are saying stuff about crafting becoming easy now and linking it to the quests too. Crafting was made easier as a whole system. The quests have nothing to do with it. Whether they have quests and gated skills or not doesn't change this. After all, you can still get turn-ins from the MB. I'm not too versed in crafting, so I don't know how much they dumbed it down. However, had I been a crafting enthusiast, I know I wouldn't be happy about something I like and enjoy becoming way too easy and just about anyone can do it effortlessly. That part I understand. But having gated skills would only deter people if the turn-in items had to be crafted by the player themselves. I also think that a big part of the problem is how easy it is now to level up crafters. For example, the restoration makes it way too easy.