Is their a DPS job, thats perfect that way it is?

[Payotz]

BLM for sure. It's the only job that didn't get impacted negatively by the ability trim, and is one of the only jobs that has kept its identity and complexity intact.

Compare that to MCH, where they threw away the "support dps that's hard to learn but easy to master" identity in favor of "the job that people flock to, to learn how to raid", eliminating depth, optimization and skill expression and as a result, alienating the old core playerbase. (Though, this also applies to BRD as well tbh).

[Rilifane]

Some jobs have plenty of space for new buttons. My machinist bars feel practically empty compared to other jobs.

They don't all need to be exactly the same, but I feel they should be aiming for all the jobs to have a similar amount of buttons to press.

I'm not sure about it. The number of buttons itself doesn't mean anything. Just look at BLM... not a ton of buttons you regulary use but still fairly high complexity if you want to play it well. And I think it's better to have some classes with less buttons while others with more to give players more options.
Less buttons doesn't have to mean a lack of complexity but wether you want to push a ton of buttons less frequently or the same buttons more frequently is a matter of taste and players deserve to have that choice.
There are as many players who don't enjoy AST or GNB for the high amount of buttons as there are players who don't enjoy MCH for the lack of it. And it's good that different classes cater to different preferences.

[Jandor]

Less buttons doesn't have to mean a lack of complexity but wether you want to push a ton of buttons less frequently or the same buttons more frequently is a matter of taste and players deserve to have that choice.
There are as many players who don't enjoy AST or GNB for the high amount of buttons as there are players who don't enjoy MCH for the lack of it. And it's good that different classes cater to different preferences.

Is it the amount of buttons that puts them off, or is their relative complexity compared to their peers? As you say, buttons don't equal complexity.

I'd like to aim for about 30 per job, but I'm not going to be upset if they don't do that. My main issue is the whole "no more space" argument when some jobs have half a dozen less actions than their peers. I don't know where I'd even put new abilities on PLD, but jobs like MCH have plenty of room for new stuff and the idea that they shouldn't get anything because other jobs are a bit too bloated already is wrong IMHO.

tl;dr I want new stuff for MCH.

[Rilifane]

Only that AST isn't complex. It's bloated with buttons that have very similiar effects on a similiar cooldown, highly mobile, doesn't have to worry about weaving and has one dot and one filler.
Don't mistake the amount of buttons for complexity.
And that's exactly what's turning many players off: lots of buttons but nothing behind them. At the same time, classes like DNC, RDM, DRG and BLM often get praises for great, fluent and fun gameplay while not having their hotbars bloated with meaningless busywork.
So asking for a specific amount of buttons doesn't make sense, certainly not for all classes across the board. They don't need to add more buttons to add new and fresh mechanics to classes. Just because you want more buttons for your MCH doesn't mean all classes should get the same treatment and streamlined when it comes to a metric that doesn't mean anything in terms of complexity or fun gameplay.

[Burningskull]

I personally feel, as a DNC main, that DNC is pretty much complete and only needs very little. Beyond giving us a single target version of Saber Dance and "maybe" making Improvisation better to use, IE not requiring the full party, I'm not sure what they could do. Anything extra feels like it might mess it up and I really wouldn't want them to do that.

[Jirah]

I should mention that this isn’t some Metahead topic I could not care any less about “Top DPS” as things change too frequent to gauge. I meant play style, the feel, the fun

The point why it’s your main

[Kahnom]

BLM and Goon have evolved into the right direction while MNK is arguably regressed somehow....

[Jandor]

Only that AST isn't complex. It's bloated with buttons that have very similiar effects on a similiar cooldown, highly mobile, doesn't have to worry about weaving and has one dot and one filler.
Don't mistake the amount of buttons for complexity.

No healer is particularly complex anymore, but AST is arguably the most complex among its peers.

[Sqwall]

I would like to say MNK WAS in a bad spot pre 5.4. The DPS job was a busy work nightmare that had you jumping through hoops like a circus animal to keep your GL stacks up to preform well.

Having said that.

The current MNK is in a good spot heading into 6.0. I feel confident about shedding all the excess baggage that MNK had to carry with it. The new MNK is really potent and MUCH easier to play.

To frame the idea of where I see MNK in 6.0 is lower the button bloat * looks at anatman*, reducing the positional to make MNK less of a mess to play optimally, and improve the class with NEW weaponskills/attacks.

Adding to my thoughts from above:
1. Give MNK skills that actually help. Anatman is useless currently and quite literally the definition of a situational skill. I have removed this from my hotbar all together.

2. I would like to say I hate the positional's for MNK. The idea of positionals on the FASTEST dps job is unessicary personally to me. I am open to the idea of only making Dragon Kick and Bootshine only skills the require positional's. This would make the movement on the job WAY less of a chore. I am also for the idea of removing the potency buffs from postional's and installing something to increase some sort of resource. Something akin to SAM.

3. Lastly.... NEW weaponskills with NEW animations. Dragon Kick, Twin snakes, Snap Punch, Bootshine, True Strike, Demolish are ALL from 2.0. Nothing has changed in nearly 8 years...and they are getting boring and tired skills. Monk needs facelift in the animation department. I would LOVE if they made MNK into a COMBO driven class, perhaps driven from NIN mudra's. Different combinations give a different outcome in the form of a weaponskill.

I'm hopeful now for MNK in 6.0

[Jirah]

I'm not sure about it. The number of buttons itself doesn't mean anything. Just look at BLM... not a ton of buttons you regulary use but still fairly high complexity if you want to play it well.

This is where context is very important in your argument, not only is MCH a very simple Job with arguably the least amount of skills in any given job, it’s also a fatty job. Example being it’s Charges 3 each for two skills doing the same damage, 2 Gcds right off the bat, and 2 inconsequential skills in turrets and Wildfire, and lateral Aoes. It’s far from complex but also is in a odd place having so much fat in a bare bones job.