Please don't delay Savage Raid Releases

[Kaurhz]

I don't see them doing something like this unless they do severely jumble around their content cycle (e.g. delay tome gear, delay crafted gear), seeing as delaying it can have consequences in other areas of the game. Namely crafting, if the tier is delayed, the need/desire for crafted gear immediately goes down, and by the time the raid patch does come out, the gear will not even be worth half as much as it currently is, since the need for it isn't really imminent for anyone.

[RyuDragnier]

But that affects the balance of the fight. I don't care as I don't do Savage, but the devs might. They could make the fights harder to account for the extra gears, which may or may not be a good thing for some people.

There is no effecting the balance of the fight. If you fail a mechanic in Savage, one of four things happen.

1. You instantly die.
2. You wipe the entire raid.
3. You take heavy damage and get a heavy debuff that can guarantee your death
4. The entire raid takes heavy damage and gets a heavy debuff that can guarantee the raid's death.

You either do those mechanics right and can keep going, or you don't and are forced to start all over. Most maxed "at current ilevel" gear can do is shave off the final few minutes of a fight at most. The mechanics that will kill you often come at set intervals during the fight (anywhere from 1-2 minutes). You are not screwing up the balance of these fights, NOTHING you can do can screw up the balance of these fights until the next expansion when you vastly outgear them.

[Wyakin]

So you think a one time story raid+cutscene would be enough to delay a week's worth of prog? What kind of group is that that's good enough for a one week prog, but not if people watch cutscenes? That's truly living on the edge.

Exactly why I don't want Savage delayed because I think it will delay tomestone release, which is my reward for content I do.

You don’t raid savage so it doesn’t effect you in the slightest. Delaying savage one week just does that, delays savage a week. It allows people to get crafted and tomb gear, leisurely enjoy the three (yes three) storylines that are released and do this without worry that they’ve got to do it before meeting with their team. Some people cannot take time off work for these things making the rush even harder. There have been so far two or three people against this and everyone else for. Times like this that really, accepting it is the smart answer

[Campi]

I also do Savage Raids Week 1
It's the most fun this game can offer, beside Ultimate Raids (for me)

I wouldn't mind, if SE delay it 1 Week, but they have to make the DPS Check in the last Fight a bit harder :shrug:

[RicaRuin]

I'd love a delay as well. Would make it easier for mixed groups where one half wishes to dive into the new tier asap while the other half wants to enjoy the Raid's story (and MSQ). Also, the general pressure that will be alleviated as others wrote countless times. Even world first wouldn't be influenced too much.

I read someone claiming people who enjoy both now would need to take 2 weeks off, but actually you'd only need the Savage Release off, with the prior week being accessible after work etc.

I started a discussion about delayed Savage a while back and suggested a few days rather than a week if that was a lot, but people rightfully informed me that such would mess with loot lockouts and weekly resets (aka people that can only raid the first two days after reset missing out on loot, for example).

I think the whole situation is because FF XIV is a very story driven game, and we don't have the strict segregation of groups into raiders and story addicts. Those groups do intersect a lot here.

[Also, what did they say about delaying Savage in this live letter? I seem to have missed it. Grateful for information!]

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

I don't see them doing something like this unless they do severely jumble around their content cycle (e.g. delay tome gear, delay crafted gear), seeing as delaying it can have consequences in other areas of the game. Namely crafting, if the tier is delayed, the need/desire for crafted gear immediately goes down, and by the time the raid patch does come out, the gear will not even be worth half as much as it currently is, since the need for it isn't really imminent for anyone.

Delaying crafted by the same time literally defeats the purpose of requesting the savage delay.

[Packetdancer]

If I understand the arguments, I think what some folks object to is the fact that if you waited one week, people would be able to get the 450 new tomestones the first week (no raid), then get another 450 after reset if you were quick to grind them, and have enough tomestones to get a chestpiece or something from the tomestone gear before stepping foot into the new savage tier, and still start on the first day. (Or you could have two accessories, instead of just one, etc.)

And I guess there's some fear that if people had access to that right out of the gate, it would 'cheapen' the world first wins because they would be done with potentially one piece of slightly better gear than would normally be available for a first-week clear? Since the tomestone gear will be ten ilevels higher than the crafted stuff.

But I honestly don't think that's a wholly reasonable concern; presumably, SquareEnix balances the fights to at least be hypothetically clearable with the minimum ilevel you can queue in with. So getting all that crafted gear on day one? That's already potentially unbalancing the fight, by that standard. Why would adding one more accessory, or replacing the accessory with one piece of left-side gear, be the final straw that broke the balance entirely?

But people don't seem to think that getting the top-tier crafted gear 'cheapens' the first week clears; I'm not sure that the potential for one piece of slightly better gear over the current hypothetical best-start gear (i.e., crafted with potentially one tomestone accessory) 'cheapens' the fights appreciably any more than using the that current best-start gear already does, by that standard.

And if it does make that much of a difference, presumably SquareEnix would balance the fights accordingly.

Meanwhile, if you feel a week one clear would be 'worth more' because it's done without benefit of better gear? Then prog and clear it with the minimum ilevel for bragging rights; that's an option right now! You don't have to get i510 crafted gear to go into the tier; you could do it with the i500 BiS of this current tier. And if they waited a week to release savage in 6.x content, that would still be an option a week later.

The only other objection I can see is if you consider the race to get an entire static outfitted with the crafted gear to also be part of that world-first race, i.e., the crafters are engaging in their own 'savage tier' to get the sets made as quickly as possible on day one. And then, yes, if you consider that part of the challenge, then delaying a week does make it easier. But no one seems to seriously consider the crafter 'first-day clears' (as it were) to be as much a race as the first-week clears are—it's not like people are eagerly tracking world-first to make a full HQ set of new fending gear, or lauding the fastest crafters on a data center ("Check out my WVR parse!")—so I think if you do consider the crafting part of the savage challenge, you may be in the minority.

[FoxyAreku]

Never saw it as a big deal tbh.

If you aren't a world first contender (and lets be real, there's a 99% chance none of you reading this are) then you can just sort out with your group to wait a week to prepare for it. It's not really the devs responsibility to hold things back because your group doesn't have self control.

It doesn't matter much either way.

[Absurdity]

If I understand the arguments, I think what some folks object to is the fact that if you waited one week, people would be able to get the 450 new tomestones the first week (no raid), then get another 450 after reset if you were quick to grind them, and have enough tomestones to get a chestpiece or something from the tomestone gear before stepping foot into the new savage tier, and still start on the first day. (Or you could have two accessories, instead of just one, etc.)

And I guess there's some fear that if people had access to that right out of the gate, it would 'cheapen' the world first wins because they would be done with potentially one piece of slightly better gear than would normally be available for a first-week clear? Since the tomestone gear will be ten ilevels higher than the crafted stuff.

But I honestly don't think that's a wholly reasonable concern; presumably, SquareEnix balances the fights to at least be hypothetically clearable with the minimum ilevel you can queue in with. So getting all that crafted gear on day one? That's already potentially unbalancing the fight, by that standard. Why would adding one more accessory, or replacing the accessory with one piece of left-side gear, be the final straw that broke the balance entirely?

But people don't seem to think that getting the top-tier crafted gear 'cheapens' the first week clears; I'm not sure that the potential for one piece of slightly better gear over the current hypothetical best-start gear (i.e., crafted with potentially one tomestone accessory) 'cheapens' the fights appreciably any more than using the that current best-start gear already does, by that standard.

The reason why full crafted gear doesn't cheapen the fight is because it is literally the minimum ilvl to beat the last fight in a raid tier, the only one that really matters in the end and on top of it everyone has access to crafted gear with the only restriction being your willingness to spend a lot of gil.


The issue with being able to get more tomestone gear isn't really that it cheapens the fight but that it basically goes against the idea of delaying it by a week in the first place, everyone being on an even playing field.
Since we're talking about the world first race then a team that managed to get 900 tomestones by the time they raid on savage release obviously has an advantage over a team that only managed to cap the first week and goes into savage with only 450 tomestones.
Not that this can really be fixed either way, you'll have to rush to cap your 450 or 900 tomestones before raid begins regardless of whether or not it gets delayed by week. The only difference being that certain jobs gain a lot more from having access to their chestpiece.

[ForteNightshade]

=[Also, what did they say about delaying Savage in this live letter? I seem to have missed it. Grateful for information!]

"Normal and Savage mode will be implemented on the same day. Yoshida is aware that he received a lot of feedbacks regarding players don't have enough time to prepare but since the flow was already decided for the entire expansion (meaning the entire Shadowbringers) they cannot just simply change it. However they will look into this for future plans."

Quoted from the reddit LL transition.

Never saw it as a big deal tbh.

If you aren't a world first contender (and lets be real, there's a 99% chance none of you reading this are) then you can just sort out with your group to wait a week to prepare for it. It's not really the devs responsibility to hold things back because your group doesn't have self control.

It doesn't matter much either way.

Why does this keep getting suggested? Waiting a week means you lose out on loot, defeating the entire point of preparation since you'll have better gear the following week anyway. It isn't a solution nor does it have anything to do with self control. Furthermore, it isn't just world prog players who are bothered by this but people attempting week 1 or early week 2 kills. As others have noted, if your static has a mixture of people who enjoy the story and others who are indifferent or want to skip everything. Some are losing out. Now if everything was released all at once, you could make the argument that's just how it goes. It isn't. Literally every other piece of content, including the first Savage tier and Ultimate, are delayed purely so players aren't rushed be it through gear preparation or story.