I'm gonna say something unpopular: I don't like to rush.

[Liam_Harper]

Do. Not. Justify. Bad. Play.

These players who do not do large pulls are either bad or ignorant. If one can safely do large pulls (which is true in the lion's share of cases, and only not true if you have no idea what your buttons do), and yet one chooses to do small pulls, one is playing poorly.

That really depends.

If you get the guy who takes one pack, picks at it nervously and goes afk half the time then sure, they're a bad player. However, if you're a tank who pulls 2 packs at a time but rotates cooldowns smoothly, uses aoe properly and keeps moving at a smooth pace, you're a better player than the guy who pulls to the wall with no cooldowns and starts single targeting. The 2 pack guy still isn't an outstanding tank, but you're going to have consistent runs with them and get done within decent time.

I don't see why there's such a crusade against tanks for not playing perfectly in a smooth run when healers and dps play their classes completely wrong a lot of the time and no one even notices or cares.

[Frosthaven]

I'll admit going from "Can we overcome this dungeon?" in legacy MMOs to "How fast can we overcome this dungeon" in modern FFXIV was a strange shift for me personally. I generally pull as fast as the group's capacity allows for just to get it over with, whereas I enjoyed replaying dungeons in other games until my eyes bled.

Having said that, no matter what you do as a tank you'll be wrong to someone. It's less about tanking mobs and more about tanking players and their expectations, I find. Really have to have the right mentality for it.

[LaylaTsarra]

Having said that, no matter what you do as a tank you'll be wrong to someone. It's less about tanking mobs and more about tanking players and their expectations, I find.

It's why a lot of people don't bother to tank in DF. Who needs to put up with the expectations of others. Many including myself prefer to tank with a FC group and with friends.

[Sophiea_sakura]

Been a WHM main i enjoy both but if im honest i like to take it easy most of time and explore dungeons to get them mapped. i will always go to the speed of the tank and if the DPS wanna rush ahead and pull which iv only had it happen once i warn them and if they carry on they can just die to there own pull ^_^fyi the 3 of us was happy with going slow but this 1 dps refused and kept pulling the entire floor and running back to us with them all i can heal threw that now iv learned alot about WHM but just respect the majority of the party if you dont like it you leave, they also did calm down after they fainted and i just shuck my finger at them and carried on walking with party.

But seriously in most parties just say or ask how fast you wanna go and if thats okay, most people iv seen will just go at the speed the tank wants too and if they wanna go fast then just try going faster and then rerun it. DPS spend alot of time in a que so there more likely to just go with what the healer and tank decide iv found

[Frosthaven]

It's why a lot of people don't bother to tank in DF. Who needs to put up with the expectations of others. Many including myself prefer to tank with a FC group and with friends.

Yeah I can definitely understand that - it's the way to go imo.

I don't mind too much, really. It's near impossible to get under my skin and I like being told when I'm doing something wrong (in the rare situation that it is actually good advice incoming). I don't think being able to completely emotionally detach should be a job-requirement, though. Probably not healthy to shut down like that. Dunno how some people handle it without going insane.

[Townowi]

Maybe the hardest of the game is actually the oldest content (as far as dungeons are concerned). Maybe the devs focused too hard on bosses to provide any challenge to that content.

I used to play a different game where you would try pulling wall-to-wall and wipe long before you reach the boss (then again, in my old game, gear counts for much less than in FF14, and that's what I liked most about it) but trash is still light on mechanics. But I digress.

Maybe it would sound radical to you but removing the mobs from dungeons may be a viable option that won't affect how hard content is. Now I am not sure about how well-liked a trash-free dungeon would be, but it would work only with the right story premise. Possible premises for trash-free dungeons include:

1) Bosses being destitute or depleted logistically
2) A spell has been cast on it beforehand to whose effects bosses (and possibly adds) are immune but would-be trash isn't
3) Bosses seem to consider mobs useless against the party
4) Bosses hold back mobs until the party reaches a point deemed strategically important enough for a boss fight, thereby lulling the party in a false sense of security
5) Bosses being the last survivors of a catastrophe that befell the area
6) A distraction pulls would-be trash away (much like in Castrum Meridianum/Pretorium but more effective as a distraction)

[linayar]

Maybe the hardest of the game is actually the oldest content (as far as dungeons are concerned). Maybe the devs focused too hard on bosses to provide any challenge to that content.

I used to play a different game where you would try pulling wall-to-wall and wipe long before you reach the boss (then again, in my old game, gear counts for much less than in FF14, and that's what I liked most about it) but trash is still light on mechanics. But I digress.

Maybe it would sound radical to you but removing the mobs from dungeons may be a viable option that won't affect how hard content is. Now I am not sure about how well-liked a trash-free dungeon would be, but it would work only with the right story premise. Possible premises for trash-free dungeons include:

1) Bosses being destitute or depleted logistically
2) A spell has been cast on it beforehand to whose effects bosses (and possibly adds) are immune but would-be trash isn't
3) Bosses seem to consider mobs useless against the party
4) Bosses hold back mobs until the party reaches a point deemed strategically important enough for a boss fight, thereby lulling the party in a false sense of security
5) Bosses being the last survivors of a catastrophe that befell the area
6) A distraction pulls would-be trash away (much like in Castrum Meridianum/Pretorium but more effective as a distraction)

I like that raids have no trash before fighting the boss, and I think I'd love it if dungeons also have no mobs, and are just a series of boss encounters with puzzles to solve in between.

[Canadane]

Wrong. The game mechanic must provide negative consequence for playing poorly. Otherwise, it's just a playstyle preference.

The negative consequence would be a slower clear time.

[dangadget]

This is not a universal negative.
There is a very vocal, and frankly bizarre subset pf the community who looks at anything less than absolutely the fastest clears possible as some sort of personal affront.
And then there's everyone else, who just want people to genuinely try, ask questions if they're confused about something, and get through the instance with a minimum of fuss and muss

[Doozer]

The negative consequence would be a slower clear time.

Yeah, and if I sleep in an extra 20 minutes on the weekend, the negative consequence is that I'll have 20 minutes less of daytime to, uh, do daytime things. It does not, however, cost me my job, my education, my health, get me in legal trouble, etc.

There's no actual punishment for taking longer in a duty, as long as you finish it within the time it gives you. The only consequence to taking too long is running out of time and failing the duty, but that's like 90 minutes or something, and I've never in my entire time playing see a dungeon take the full duration.