"Elitism" vs "Casualism"

[Goji1639]

Well, herein lies the problem.

People don't realize they are bad because we aren't allowed to speak up for fear of offending someone and being reported.

These people then go into harder content, are told they are bad because they can't follow basic mechanics and even the most basic of job rotations, let alone the more advanced mechanics and job optimizations.

Then, they come on the forums and complain about "toxic elitists", and how hard content is too hard and should be nerfed because "I paid for it, and so I should be able to do it"

Most people who play this game will never go into hard content. There's very little of it and you have to actively seek it out. Players who decide they want to be Savage raiders are generally going to be well aware that learning and solid play will be required.

The casuals who complain about toxic elitists are likely experiencing them in roulettes, and other easy content. In roulettes I feel like some people just want to come up with reasons to take them way more seriously than necessary. People want to feel like there are stakes, because they don't get to feel that way often in this game.

It's easy stuff, though; why care THAT much that you're carrying the occasional bad player?

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Most people who play this game will never go into hard content. There's very little of it and you have to actively seek it out. Players who decide they want to be Savage raiders are generally going to be well aware that learning and solid play will be required.

The casuals who complain about toxic elitists are likely experiencing them in roulettes, and other easy content. In roulettes I feel like some people just want to come up with reasons to take them way more seriously than necessary. People want to feel like there are stakes, because they don't get to feel that way often in this game.

It's easy stuff, though; why care THAT much that you're carrying the occasional bad player?

Because if everyone was bad, no one would get anything done, and there aren't first class players and second class players, so they don't get the privilege of slacking off when others aren't.

[Goji1639]

Because if everyone was bad, no one would get anything done, and there aren't first class players and second class players, so they don't get the privilege of slacking off when others aren't.

People who want to be good at the game take it upon themselves to do so, and there are enough of those kinds of people to get the very sparse difficult content in this game done.

Your advice in roulettes isn't turning casual players into serious ones, and there's no reason to flip out about "carrying" casual players in easy content.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

People who want to be good at the game take it upon themselves to do so, and there are enough of those kinds of people to get the very sparse difficult content in this game done.

Your advice in roulettes isn't turning casual players into serious ones, and there's no reason to flip out about "carrying" casual players in easy content.

Having people who take upon themselves to be good at the game doesn't mean you get to take advantage of them and slack off.

It's selfish and rude to boot.

"I have good people at my work group so I can rely on them, do a lousy job and pass thanks to their work."

[Goji1639]

Having people who take upon themselves to be good at the game doesn't mean you get to take advantage of them and slack off.

It's selfish and rude to boot.

Hell, technically it's rude to not be doing everything in your power to play 100% optimally in all content when you're grouped with others. Anything less and you're shortchanging the people around you to make your own life easier.

Having to be offended every time a DPS plays sloppy; a Healer doesn't DPS; a tank doesn't wall to wall just sounds exhausting to me. Carrying the occasional "bad" players is a lot more fun than your life in roulettes sounds.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Hell, technically it's rude to not be doing everything in your power to play 100% optimally in all content when you're grouped with others. Anything less and you're shortchanging the people around you to make your own life easier.

Having to be offended every time a DPS plays sloppy; a Healer doesn't DPS; a tank doesn't wall to wall just sounds exhausting to me. Carrying the occasional "bad" players is a lot more fun than your life in roulettes sounds.

I don't know where this argument is coming from, because doing your rotation well in roulettes isn't hard at all or exhausting.

They're not occasional and you've already proven yourself to not be on the carrying side of the field. ;-)

[Goji1639]

I don't know where this argument is coming from, because doing your rotation well in roulettes isn't hard at all or exhausting.

They're not occasional and you've already proven yourself to not be on the carrying side of the field. ;-)

Actually, it's usually the ones who complain the hardest about "carrying" people that are projecting and overcompensating. Like if you whine enough about bad players you'll convince the world that you're not one.

I never said doing your basic rotations is exhausting, but that's not all it takes to play 100% optimally.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Most people who play this game will never go into hard content. There's very little of it and you have to actively seek it out. Players who decide they want to be Savage raiders are generally going to be well aware that learning and solid play will be required.

The casuals who complain about toxic elitists are likely experiencing them in roulettes, and other easy content. In roulettes I feel like some people just want to come up with reasons to take them way more seriously than necessary. People want to feel like there are stakes, because they don't get to feel that way often in this game.

It's easy stuff, though; why care THAT much that you're carrying the occasional bad player?

Except the thread about ex fights in mentor roulette speaks otherwise.