6.0 Both Tank and Healers Need Major Focus on Bringing Back Job Identity

[Billythepancake]

Healers are perfectly fine and balanced . I dunno in whats facts ppl think they dont evolve or they dont care about them. Im playing healer since realm reborn and they never had complex dps rotations , u are whining for what a 1 , 2 dot u lost ? For the love of god. You are playing to HEAL not to dps. Thats the trend that goes around the last year that why i see everyday more and more useless healers unable to keep ppl alive cause they are focused on pressing the 1 dps button they have. If you want to dps play a dps. I remember when u had to cleric stance to dps, that was a challenge. 80% of healers couldnt perform or add any dps back then. Noone needed or asked them to dps.
About tank yeah they made easier to play and thats not bad. Even when tank stances were on. They were kind of useless anyway. A good tank was always building aggro then drop the stance for plenty of time. Some ppl refuse to accept that world is moving and changes and u cant have the same thing forever, things are evolving.
Conclusion, im very happy with healers state at this point cause without cleric stance more newbie healers can do sone dmg to contribute plus can more easily focus to do what their role is about. HEALING . Only thing im sad is that astro lost his card variety cause THIS same community was crying all day that cards are all useless and we just need balance. Now u got it. And one of the most intresting healing class became braindead. Congratz einsteins

SCH has lost Miasma, Miasma II, bane, shadowflare, cleric stance, fey wind, and at the begining of ShB they lost energy drain too until SE was yelled at constantly about how stupid that was so they gave it back. So, in a single expansion SCH lost 6 DPS abilities. I'm not sure where you're pulling up this "you've only lost 1-2 dots" nonsense from. I'm sure if I looked up HW SCH I found find even more DPS abilities they've lost. That's a pretty significant chunk of their downtime gone. Yes I am a healer, I'm also a combat medic. Healers spend most of their time DPSing, that time should be as fun as anything else. I should have something to do other than spam Broil until I go numb. If you're having fun, great, far be it from me to take that away from you, but to try and lie just to make the people who are perfectly valid in being upset seem unreasonable is just pathetic.

[elioaiko]

Healers are perfectly fine and balanced . I dunno in whats facts ppl think they dont evolve or they dont care about them. Im playing healer since realm reborn and they never had complex dps rotations , u are whining for what a 1 , 2 dot u lost ? For the love of god. You are playing to HEAL not to dps. Thats the trend that goes around the last year that why i see everyday more and more useless healers unable to keep ppl alive cause they are focused on pressing the 1 dps button they have. If you want to dps play a dps. I remember when u had to cleric stance to dps, that was a challenge. 80% of healers couldnt perform or add any dps back then. Noone needed or asked them to dps.
About tank yeah they made easier to play and thats not bad. Even when tank stances were on. They were kind of useless anyway. A good tank was always building aggro then drop the stance for plenty of time. Some ppl refuse to accept that world is moving and changes and u cant have the same thing forever, things are evolving.
Conclusion, im very happy with healers state at this point cause without cleric stance more newbie healers can do sone dmg to contribute plus can more easily focus to do what their role is about. HEALING . Only thing im sad is that astro lost his card variety cause THIS same community was crying all day that cards are all useless and we just need balance. Now u got it. And one of the most intresting healing class became braindead. Congratz einsteins

I'm actually tired of seeing you repeat the same song and dance in each healer thread. Since you're so happy with how healers are, then go play and be happy. No reason to sit here and argue with us right? Also SE removing the variety from AST was not linked directly to complaints, it was hard for them to balance out and they were gunning for a way to make it consistent. Unfortunate but that's a problem you have to tell SE to change.

Also, healers are just healbots to you? Idk if you are playing the same game as the rest of us but if you were half the healer you claim you are since there's so many useless ones to you these days, then you would know that you're either sitting and doing NOTHING or realizing that healer gameplay consist of healing effectively but doing that, you spend your downtime dpsing which is A LOT because of the lack of damage going out. Also SCH losing their dots is a big deal because they got nothing else in return.

We even had to beg SE to give us back Energy Drain, when we had to way to spend Aetherflow withoit dropping them on Lustrates and 90% of the time, it just adds up to overheal.

People are allowed to voice their opinions, developers need feedback in order to learn and grow. SE is no exception to that. If we just sat there and pretended everything was okay, then the healer community would probably be gone. Imagine if DPS had no feedback on NIN and SMN needing changes, then they would stay in the same state they were in.

[Hanayumi]

Anybody figure out a good system for healers and tanks without actually more skills than what we current have? Its one the things people tend to overlook, devs want to keep skill/spell amounts to a certain point so hotbars and crossbars arent flooded with them, so the solution of bringing back or adding more so and so skills isnt so cut and dry.

[QooEr]

Anybody figure out a good system for healers and tanks without actually more skills than what we current have? Its one the things people tend to overlook, devs want to keep skill/spell amounts to a certain point so hotbars and crossbars arent flooded with them, so the solution of bringing back or adding more so and so skills isnt so cut and dry.

figuring that kind of stuff is the devs job but ill humor you

first off a lot of "new" skills are just old deleted skills but introduced as something different. for instance rouse (buff your summon!) turned into seraph
largesse became temperance and neutral sect
bloodbath became nascent flash
etc

i agree that scholar always did have a lot of skills, perhaps even too many to comfortably map them on controller, but that was part of what made the job unique. if someone didnt like managing so many skills, ast and whm were always an option

that aside theres potential in skills that transform themselves. instead of using 2 hotbar spaces for fey blessing and consolation (fairy aoe heal), the former could become the latter when you use seraph since you cant use both at the same time anyways. whispering dawn and angels whisper already does this. having skills that become other skills under certain conditions could help you add things without bloating the hotbar

finally if you want to add new things to a job, rather than adding more skills that fill the same oversaturated niche itd just be better to add something else that gave extra value (did scholar or astro really need yet another ogcd aoe heal with a short cooldown after lv 70? no they didn't) smart use of traits goes a long way for this. ast and sch get incredible traits at lv 78 that change the way those jobs are played, and they were just simple changes to already existing skills

[AbelArchaniEA]

Hey blunt. Where’s your data to confirm that “veteran players” are leaving at the same ratio as new players? Lmao dude save the drama. If you don’t like the game go play last of us 2. Seems like a fit for you

[ItMe]

I'm actually tired of seeing you repeat the same song and dance in each healer thread. Since you're so happy with how healers are, then go play and be happy. No reason to sit here and argue with us right?

[...]

People are allowed to voice their opinions, developers need feedback in order to learn and grow. SE is no exception to that.

Your comment is kind of at odds with itself.
It sounds like you just want a place where people can voice their opinions, so long as they're unhappy and are sharing ideas on how to change healers.
Unfortunately, that's not what this, or really any thread can be.

[Jandor]

You are playing to HEAL not to dps.

I'm playing to keep the party alive. There is a lot of overlap there with healing, but the venn diagram is not a perfect circle.

[Torunya]

I haven't read everything, so forgive me if I reiterate what others have already said.

I'm a returning player who hasn't played since Heavensward. My take on the jobs -- as I see them today, and what they have become -- is that some of them have indeed lost much of their identity. Homogenisation seems to have come at the cost of diversity, and, to this extent, I think it's a bit sad to see. While I understand that homogenising the jobs can make them more accessible as well as avoiding that certain jobs within roles be actively preferred over others, I think it's the wrong approach.

As someone who greatly enjoyed Sch and War back in the day, I feel that these two jobs have lost much of their niche now. At least, I personally don't derive as much joy from dps-ing as a Sch today now that all my DoTs are gone, and not having bloodbath on my War just makes me feel like I'm missing something important inside.

I suppose, we're all at the mercy of which direction the devs want to take this; however, seeing as some jobs are actually doing quite well in ShB, I don't think homogenising the jobs is the answer.

[Kazukiyashuo]

SCH has lost Miasma, Miasma II, bane, shadowflare, cleric stance, fey wind, and at the begining of ShB they lost energy drain too until SE was yelled at constantly about how stupid that was so they gave it back. So, in a single expansion SCH lost 6 DPS abilities. I'm not sure where you're pulling up this "you've only lost 1-2 dots" nonsense from. I'm sure if I looked up HW SCH I found find even more DPS abilities they've lost. That's a pretty significant chunk of their downtime gone. Yes I am a healer, I'm also a combat medic. Healers spend most of their time DPSing, that time should be as fun as anything else. I should have something to do other than spam Broil until I go numb. If you're having fun, great, far be it from me to take that away from you, but to try and lie just to make the people who are perfectly valid in being upset seem unreasonable is just pathetic.

Plz dont go into that route im perfectly know what im telling. Sch lost 2 dots. Bane was to spread dots making them aoe dps, shadowflare is removed even from summoner aka removed from the game and fey was some lame at. Speed increase. Thats still 2 dots to me. IN RETURN.... sch got art of war that didnt have and instead of lame 3% at. Speed or was is 2%? He got critical increase for the party, to compansate for that dots bane aoe dps he had. IF you add potencies of dots they result to art of war, which i wanna mention that is instant cast, compared to other healers. So your point is? Let me tell you. There is not point. Schs just cry without any particular reason

[Kazukiyashuo]

I'm actually tired of seeing you repeat the same song and dance in each healer thread. Since you're so happy with how healers are, then go play and be happy. No reason to sit here and argue with us right? Also SE removing the variety from AST was not linked directly to complaints, it was hard for them to balance out and they were gunning for a way to make it consistent. Unfortunate but that's a problem you have to tell SE to change.

Also, healers are just healbots to you? Idk if you are playing the same game as the rest of us but if you were half the healer you claim you are since there's so many useless ones to you these days, then you would know that you're either sitting and doing NOTHING or realizing that healer gameplay consist of healing effectively but doing that, you spend your downtime dpsing which is A LOT because of the lack of damage going out. Also SCH losing their dots is a big deal because they got nothing else in return.

We even had to beg SE to give us back Energy Drain, when we had to way to spend Aetherflow withoit dropping them on Lustrates and 90% of the time, it just adds up to overheal.

People are allowed to voice their opinions, developers need feedback in order to learn and grow. SE is no exception to that. If we just sat there and pretended everything was okay, then the healer community would probably be gone. Imagine if DPS had no feedback on NIN and SMN needing changes, then they would stay in the same state they were in.

You got your answer above. Schs got nothing in return. Too dramatic. And obviously a lie. I dunno why its tiring when someone express their opinion, maybe cause its different ? Maybe you are upset that your whining doesnt affect all community ? Healer were always simple in their dps skills even when we had cleric stance that was harder to deal with. Crying to the forums that the dps is boring cause u are pressing 3 buttons instead of 5 is stupid in my opinion. If you want more complex dps skills pick a dps. Not once in a million SE will add more dps tools to healers. You cry all day here . Peace