This game needs to give us all our skills at lvl 50.

[GeminiReed]

What I'd like is more crucial skills showing up earlier, but maybe traits at later levels open up functionality, increase effectiveness, reduce CD, etc. That is actually what a lot of traits already do; PLD gets instant spells, for instance. I don't think they have to make all of everyone's kit available at a low level, though they can probably improve the gameplay experience by making stuff that feel super core to the job experience available a little sooner. It's said a lot but The Black Night should show up sooner, but maybe has a longer CD until you get a trait at 70. Little balance levers like that.

I sort of agree but adjustments need to be done with care to ensure that they do not affect the core rotation. Timing changes and additional charges can affect how skills align or make certain synergies possible. That in turn can radically change the preferred rotation or priority (or swap between rotation and priority, lol). Even potency adjustments can cause that. (eg. under level X only hit skill B to refresh the buff then until level Y spam it until level Z where you alternate between B and C)

At least we don't have set bonuses.

[HeulGDarian]

Did everyone forget that not every spell in the game is an upgraded version of an older one? and that they also add new ones every expansion? If it was a completed rotation that devs dont want to expand upon anymore and if it could be balanced with jobs that dont fulfill those requirements and if it didnt trivialise way too much old encounters then maybe yes but thats an impossible big if. Lets be reasonable about it , its a fun concept but its literally impossible

[MsMisato]

Big negative. The game is easy enough as it is. In fact MSQ is just that, its casual gameplay.

But in all honesty it should take no more than 15 minutes to run a dungeon a majority of the time. I think the longest is either tik tok with the slime slowing everything down or AV because for whatever reason people simply lack awareness of their surroundings there and run around like its the end of the world. Besides ARR dungeons and I want to say HW dungeons already locked in based off level currently.

having all the skills available would require a rework of the entire ARR and HW environments bring it into balance. Its not a simple flip the switch and honestly I would rather them focus on more current and future content.

[Avidria]

Some adjustments to get more earlier would absolutely be welcome, even some before 50. Black mage in particular is mind-numbingly boring at lower levels, and every class that doesn't have AoE at really low levels is both frustrating AND boring. Especially dragoon. Why TF is their first AoE so late?

[Vyrerus]

Melees don't get AOEs until later in their rotations because they operate under the principle that DPS should remove problem monsters first, rather than AOEing everything down in unison. Also the fact that they have higher potencies innately over ranged, and used to have higher weapon damage too, meaning unless you pulled two or more groups, single target was still better damage. That and the artifact that was TP, along with the skill invigorate originally being a subclass skill only obtained by having level 22 Lancer. Even with Invigorate, on melee you'd have to stop AOEing at some point in a pull that lasts long enough or every other pull, due to TP constraints.

As for the topic at hand. No, no, jobs should not be given their entire rotation at 50. That removes all semblance of growth and development associated with the job quest structure and would make leveling feel more mind numbing than it already is(even though I don't feel that way personally). If your request were heeded, the next demand would be to lower the level cap to 50 and never raise it. Then the demand after that would be, why have levels at all. It's asking too much, and it doesn't fix anything.

IMHO, they should consider rebalancing low level rotations, now that TP no longer exists, and add in combo bonuses for using AOEs properly, such as, "Increases potency of next AOE if this AOE hits 4 or more targets." They should reward proper play innately by having proper play enhance the rotation, so it's visible outside of knowing the numbers associated with the tooltips. We already established eons ago that hardly anyone reads their tooltips, let alone maths out potencies, heh. When used properly have the AOE light up to encourage repeated use or maybe have an oGCD tied to it like the Continuation combo. Idk.

[Jandor]

Topic: This game needs to give us all our skills at lvl 50.

I wouldn't say we need all our skills by level 50, but could certainly do with a more sensible selection of skills by that level.

IMHO, level progression should loosely follow something like the following format:

01-30: A core of 10-15 skills so that every class has something to do both single target and AoE.
31-50: Get your job gauge, a way to build it, and a way to spend it.
51-80: Fleshing out the kit with more advanced or niche tools, and upgrades to older skills.

[StriderShinryu]

AoE skills are an interesting one. While it definitely does feel that some classes take "too long" to get their AoEs, I'm not sure I really agree that every class needs to get them "By X Level" or "At Y Level." The game already treads very close to a line where classes can feel too similar. By mandating that all classes get specific pieces of their toolkit at the exact same level it could make the classes feel like they're going through the exact same progression path.

[Jirah]

No, frankly it would make early content piss easy unless balanced properly. You know how many dungeons are in ff14? Balancing all of them for 80 skills is a nightmare.

Thankfully as a MCH main, you get 90% of your tool kit at 50 anyways. Besides 2 skills the 30 levels of skills are just “upgrades” or aoe

[Gemina]

It's not really that difficult. All they have to do is stop adding abilities to class quests; give us glamours or something instead if we need a carrot on top of enjoying the story.

Beyond that it's not "harder" to make the level requirement for a new skill 50 instead of 80, 90, whatever...

This would make leveling redundant, and not even what I'm talking about when it comes to the difficulty. That refers to having to rework current content to accommodate the skills that didn't exist when they were designed, and having to constantly do it every time new skills are added, regardless of the level you get access to them.

It's just as easy for you to either sync down to the content, or avoid it entirely. You don't need your roulettes. They are convenient way for you to acquire tomes and exp. In the case of tomes, I am actually really surprised this game allows you to acquire the most current currency running old content in the first place, but I also understand that it is really helpful to give incentive to players to run content they've already cleared. However, getting hacked at the kneecaps when you use roulettes is part of the cost to that convenience.

Again; if you want to use your max level skillset, then I highly suggest you queue into max level content. Period.

[Avidria]

Melees don't get AOEs until later in their rotations because they operate under the principle that DPS should remove problem monsters first, rather than AOEing everything down in unison. Also the fact that they have higher potencies innately over ranged, and used to have higher weapon damage too, meaning unless you pulled two or more groups, single target was still better damage. That and the artifact that was TP, along with the skill invigorate originally being a subclass skill only obtained by having level 22 Lancer. Even with Invigorate, on melee you'd have to stop AOEing at some point in a pull that lasts long enough or every other pull, due to TP constraints.

As for the topic at hand. No, no, jobs should not be given their entire rotation at 50. That removes all semblance of growth and development associated with the job quest structure and would make leveling feel more mind numbing than it already is(even though I don't feel that way personally). If your request were heeded, the next demand would be to lower the level cap to 50 and never raise it. Then the demand after that would be, why have levels at all. It's asking too much, and it doesn't fix anything.

IMHO, they should consider rebalancing low level rotations, now that TP no longer exists, and add in combo bonuses for using AOEs properly, such as, "Increases potency of next AOE if this AOE hits 4 or more targets." They should reward proper play innately by having proper play enhance the rotation, so it's visible outside of knowing the numbers associated with the tooltips. We already established eons ago that hardly anyone reads their tooltips, let alone maths out potencies, heh. When used properly have the AOE light up to encourage repeated use or maybe have an oGCD tied to it like the Continuation combo. Idk.

Mobile editing is awful so I can't snip this down lmao but it's really the first paragraph

Whatever the original reason for melee getting their AoE so late, while interesting to think about, the result now is that I absolutely dread getting a very low level dungeon on those dps that have zero aoe... it's just so ungodly boring, and even if it's not actually lower dps than aoe would be, it sure feels like it is. And nowadays anyway, higher level dungeon design lends itself far more to aoe spamming everything down than single targeting anything that isn't a boss. Going from playing dancer the spinny aoe fest to dragoon mc only poke one thing at a time is enough to have me regret queueing for a leveling roulette all by itself half the time :P

I don't think we should just get everything at 50, to be clear, but I would definitely like to see some reallocation of some abilities.

Edit - basically I agree with your last paragraph