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  1. #1
    Player
    TeraRamis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    606
    Character
    Tiffah Lockhart
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 82
    Quote Originally Posted by Insertusernamehere View Post
    About question: I believe SHB main story taken / inspired from "Utopia: Amaurot (Thomas More/1516)"
    From wiki (Utopia): "all people wear the same types of simple clothes and there are no dressmakers making fine apparel"
    Rich / poor, ignorant / educated etc.. no longer subject to direct judgement if they have same appearance. For this reason they wear same clothes and live as equal.

    I think story very simple:

    "The Voice of Emet-Selch: The fabric of our star began to fray..."
    "The Voice of Emet-Selch: The star was fading. We saw we had to weave its laws anew..."

    I think he is referring a star dying. It run out of fuel.. and they have to alter laws of their star (apparently failed).
    I believe they experienced a stars collapse prior to supernova. Possibility supernova caused creation of Hydaelyn (our planet infused by crystal maybe good Ascian guys doing? not sure...) and other altered versions of Hydaelyn (multiple similar planets) also caused destruction of Zodiark (their planet(s)).

    Story also throws some details here and there but most of them makes no sense to me. I believe those details not meant to be explained, place holder for possible further story line.
    They seem to convolute and confuse the word 'star' and 'planet.' Most of the text leads me to believe that they were living on the 'star,' which is - in fact - a planet.

    I've seen no evidence from the dialogue that this was a solar-borne disaster. Emet Selch describes noises coming from the ground beneath their feet as the first warning signs of doom.

    It is very curious that more emphasis hasn't been put on discovering the nature of the original calamity, and why the ancients concluded that the only means to prevent it was to summon - or, really, create - a dark-oriented self-aware God-being to stave off disaster. Why wouldn't you just sacrifice the lives and heal the planet directly? Or, even more to the point: why not just pack up and leave, using your magic to create an ideal new world elsewhere?

    I appreciate that "the story is the story," but when the route character trod from point A to point B is inexplicably confused, it leads me to want questions answered.

    I have a feeling that we are going to eventually learn that a disaster did not presage the creation of Zodiark, but that Zodiark was created (accidentally or otherwise) and then disaster occurred, requiring sacrifice to stave it off. This would help explain our character's (our soul's) departure from the Council of 14 as some form of protest against a reckless course of action, and would also go a long way to answering why the Amaurotians would develop such a stupid solution (we've got to sacrifice half our populace twice) to 'save' the world - they had no other choice (and would also explain why the opposition elected to create Hydaelan as an imperfect foil).

    My narrative Spidey Sense is telling me that this is some kind of analogous tale to the fall of Zeal in Chrono Trigger.
    (3)
    Last edited by TeraRamis; 06-18-2020 at 11:25 PM.

  2. #2
    Player
    TinkerTech's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Posts
    28
    Character
    Tinka Ortechl
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by TeraRamis View Post
    They seem to convolute and confuse the word 'star' and 'planet.' Most of the text leads me to believe that they were living on the 'star,' which is - in fact - a planet.

    I've seen no evidence from the dialogue that this was a solar-borne disaster. Emet Selch describes noises coming from the ground beneath their feet as the first warning signs of doom.
    I'm not an expert in Japanese language by any means, but I've read elsewhere that this draws from the Japanese language using the same word for 'planet' and 'star'. (You see this more egregiously in FFXV) It's merely a translation hiccup. Not really anything to read too much into.... Unless that's what they WANT us to think. /s

    I read the debacle as "We created Zodiark to revive our home and stave off disaster, but it cost us over half our population. We want them back." And somehow, by un-sundering the shards, they will achieve his. By default, once a life is gone, it's gone. So either the lost Aumorites are in some limbo they can be retrieved from, or Emet-Sech and Co. are in a state of extreme denial. (Which, considering everything they did led to their world being shattered and their loved ones lost, can you blame them?)

    As for "Why didn't they look more into what was causing it?" Personally, I think it stems from a lack of adversity. There was no war in their world, no struggle for survival until the Sound happened. They were caught completely off-guard and weren't used to thinking under pressure. They just wanted it to STOP. Really, the Ascians should be using the world and its people as it currently is to help them solve this problem; they're used to situations like that and working to find the root cause, not just reacting to the symptoms. (and, being in a sundered state, may be immune to the mind-rending effects of the Sound.)
    (0)

  3. #3
    Player
    Morningstar1337's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Ul'Dah
    Posts
    3,492
    Character
    Aurora Aura
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerTech View Post
    I'm not an expert in Japanese language by any means, but I've read elsewhere that this draws from the Japanese language using the same word for 'planet' and 'star'. (You see this more egregiously in FFXV) It's merely a translation hiccup. Not really anything to read too much into.... Unless that's what they WANT us to think. /s

    I don't find it a hiccup. It was going on too long for these instances to be isolated incidents. And it seems to be just poetic enough to fit into English as a synonym.

    Plus AFAIK, several planets were confused as starts before their discovery, Venus, Jupiter, etc.
    (2)

  4. #4
    Player
    TeraRamis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
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    606
    Character
    Tiffah Lockhart
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 82
    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerTech View Post
    I read the debacle as "We created Zodiark to revive our home and stave off disaster, but it cost us over half our population. We want them back." And somehow, by un-sundering the shards, they will achieve his. By default, once a life is gone, it's gone. So either the lost Aumorites are in some limbo they can be retrieved from, or Emet-Sech and Co. are in a state of extreme denial. (Which, considering everything they did led to their world being shattered and their loved ones lost, can you blame them?)
    I'm inclined to believe it is the latter. It's been pretty much confirmed by the SHB story that souls are basically recycled (yet can still, under certain circumstances, carry over recognizable attributes of their previous incarnations). I think that one of the big "revelations" and 'stick it to yah' moments against the Ascians is going to wind up being that the whole time they were tormenting the shards, they were really just killing off the same ancients again and again.
    (1)

  5. #5
    Player
    MirronTulaxia's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2020
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    523
    Character
    Mirron Tulaxia
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    I believe Zodiark probably could pull off reviving the lost ones. We have seen someone pull off revival, temporarily and on a small scale, with ten years as a gap. But that’s an ordinary alchemist. Not the most ancient of Primals. I’m not inclined to say it absolutely could be done, but it at least seems plausible to buy he could pull it off.
    (0)

  6. #6
    Player
    Insertusernamehere's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    189
    Character
    Misha Fiertze
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 90
    TBH We can only speculate because story so vague...

    However I believe good Ascian guys who created Hydaelyn (probably crystal covering the planet) used their own souls to power it...
    However creators of Zodiark tried different approach attempt to use lesser races and their own half population to weave stars laws. We know it is failed.

    I think we are shattered souls belonged to other lesser races (minus WOL maybe) after supernova Hydaelyn revived lesser races and formed new planets. This is why Ascian considers us unreal / mockery / made up.
    I think what Ascians trying to do undo supernova event with joining. In previous trials they demonstrated they have power over time itself. But how much power they need to undo all events?

    Ascian near god beings but not gods. They have limits like creators of Omega and their enemy Midgardsormr.
    Midgardsormr only one who managed travel between stars while creators of Omega failed or refused to travel.

    What made me believe supernova event dungeon called "Amaurot" at some point of dungeon it will take you a shattered piece of planet slowly consumed by star. However I am not sure about if English translation correct.
    Another thing a dying star does not emits light.. surrounding planets always at night phase. Dungeon have same theme.

    Both Zodiark and Hydaelyn also Omega seems mere tools created for preset purposes.. Calling them god seems weird to me. Perhaps its just translation.
    (0)
    Last edited by Insertusernamehere; 06-19-2020 at 12:18 AM.