Do u think jobs will get new skills in 6.0

[wereotter]

Yeah, they'll always add new skills. But it would be awesome if they stop removing old skills in order to add new ones.

They need to remove skills in order to keep you from having too many buttons, though. This was an issue they noticed from the Heavensward to Stormblood transition that they just didn't want players to have to deal with that many.

I would hope at this point that more of what we get are traits that improve existing skills rather than make the low level toolkit even more barren than it currently is.

[Videra]

They need to remove skills in order to keep you from having too many buttons, though. This was an issue they noticed from the Heavensward to Stormblood transition that they just didn't want players to have to deal with that many.

I would hope at this point that more of what we get are traits that improve existing skills rather than make the low level toolkit even more barren than it currently is.

'Heavensward button bloat' was a myth. All the consistent expansion re-works have done with FFXIV is dumb down classes and remove systems, like TP, aggro management via shirk before just ripping out the concept of stances entirely, cleric stance - which was divisive - and many, many other we've regrettably lost as time has gone on.

[Seraphor]

'Heavensward button bloat' was a myth. All the consistent expansion re-works have done with FFXIV is dumb down classes and remove systems, like TP, aggro management via shirk before just ripping out the concept of stances entirely, cleric stance - which was divisive - and many, many other we've regrettably lost as time has gone on.

Most tanks are happy with the loss of tank/dps stances.
All you ever did was put tank stance on until you had an aggro lead, then switch back to dps stance.

And I don't know the consensus on TP, but I haven't seen anyone say they miss it yet.

Protect, in the form it was in, had to go.
I'd have preferred if WHM's got it back in place of Divine Benison personally, but either way, a 30 minute buff that is just expected to always be up is the epitome of redundant.

[Videra]

Most tanks are happy with the loss of tank/dps stances.
All you ever did was put tank stance on until you had an aggro lead, then switch back to dps stance.

True in Stormblood, I've said as much myself. Not so in Heavensward. Stance dancing was an actual thing in HW.

[ForteNightshade]

True in Stormblood, I've said as much myself. Not so in Heavensward. Stance dancing was an actual thing in HW.

No, it was not. Tanks simply Provoked off each other to maintain aggro while Quelling Strikes was basically a requirement for raiding. By Creator, Dark Knights had long figured out they didn't even need their Power Slash combo. The only thing different is you had to do an aggro combo on pull, though Shadewalking somewhat negated that. Regardless, stance dancing has never. It only happened early on because players didn't know any better and Savage was significantly harder. But even then, tanks were dropping stance for the vast majority of the fight in Midas.

With all that said, aggro management was never an engaging mechanic because it's entirely binary. You either have it or you fail. If maintaining aggro beyond that—like how second aggro is occasionally a thing—that would make it interesting. But it mostly hasn't been.

Now onto the topic itself. I actually hope they focus more on upgrading existing skills and re-organizing our existing ones. It makes little to no sense Dragoon doesn't get an AoE until level 40; Dark Knight doesn't have its second AoE combo finisher until 72, and etc.

[SpeckledBurd]

'Heavensward button bloat' was a myth. All the consistent expansion re-works have done with FFXIV is dumb down classes and remove systems, like TP, aggro management via shirk before just ripping out the concept of stances entirely, cleric stance - which was divisive - and many, many other we've regrettably lost as time has gone on.

There was button bloat but they were just the skills were the ones that may as well have not existed because you set them and forgot them like Ninja/Monk Stances, or skills that may as well have not existed for how useless they were like Featherfoot/Haymaker/One-Ilm Punch. The problem was they also wiped out skills that weren't bloat like Touch of Death and Phlebotomize, and most of the "bloat" they removed going into Shadowbringers really weren't or they were making a change they should have made in Stormblood where they were making Gauges a thing.

[Ultimatecalibur]

There was button bloat but they were just the skills were the ones that may as well have not existed because you set them and forgot them like Ninja/Monk Stances, or skills that may as well have not existed for how useless they were like Featherfoot/Haymaker/One-Ilm Punch. The problem was they also wiped out skills that weren't bloat like Touch of Death and Phlebotomize, and most of the "bloat" they removed going into Shadowbringers really weren't or they were making a change they should have made in Stormblood where they were making Gauges a thing.

Most of the DoTs were removed due to all the DoTs and debuffs ARR and HW put on bosses. Since pretty much everyone had at least 1 DoT and 1 debuff it was often impossible to see if your own DoTs/Debuffs were up in Alliance content and on A and S rank Hunts.

[ForteNightshade]

Every time they add new stuff and remove old stuff... it makes playing stuff synced to level 50 all the more painful.

As a WHM, playing below 60ish feels like a completely different job. Playing WHM below 50 just hurts..

This is one reason I hope instead of adding new buttons, they spend more time re-scaling existing abilities and simply upgrade them later. A big reason I all but ignore half the roulettes nowadays is I hate being synced to 50 or even 60 on some jobs.

Most of the DoTs were removed due to all the DoTs and debuffs ARR and HW put on bosses. Since pretty much everyone had at least 1 DoT and 1 debuff it was often impossible to see if your own DoTs/Debuffs were up in Alliance content and on A and S rank Hunts.

To be blunt. Who cares? It wasn't like seeing your DoT mattered in that content, especially hunts. Those get zerged into oblivion. Frankly, I think it had more to do with more casual players not maintaining said DoTs so the devs wanted to make things more straight forward.

[Ultimatecalibur]

To be blunt. Who cares? It wasn't like seeing your DoT mattered in that content, especially hunts. Those get zerged into oblivion.

Now with cross world visiting they do, but on smaller servers zerging wasn't quite as effective. World Boss fates, S rank hunts and Alliance Raids were very difficult for Bards, Summoners, Monks, Dragoons, Ninjas and Scholars during ARR and HW. In many cases dps checks were failed because people could not see debuffs, dots and even buffs because of the display limit.

Frankly, I think it had more to do with more casual players not maintaining said DoTs so the devs wanted to make things more straight forward.

The fact that DoT/Debuff/buff display limits caused problems was one the stated reason that the number of DoTs was culled in StB. You could not maintain your DoTs/reapply your Dots properly if you couldn't even tell if they were on there. It was actually possible for a full party to nearly hit the display limit on its own.

The resistance down Debuffs on the other hand were culled due to forcing compositions.

[MariaArvana]

To be blunt. Who cares? It wasn't like seeing your DoT mattered in that content, especially hunts. Those get zerged into oblivion. Frankly, I think it had more to do with more casual players not maintaining said DoTs so the devs wanted to make things more straight forward.

When ARR & HW's SMN did 0 damage on each Fester if their DOTs weren't on the boss and fester was one of their strongest attacks, and the DoTs themselves made up a considerable amount of damage, it kinda mattered quite a bit. You get one too many SMNs in an alliance raid and suddenly bosses are dying slower than usual due to festers being whiffed, DoTs not being optimally re-applied. Or worse, you can't even apply them because the boss hit its debuff limit.

Like, imagine if just randomly, one of your strongest OGCD attacks on any other job suddenly did 0 damage because "oh, too many people hit the boss at the same time." It would get pretty annoying. It was especially egregious in ARR where SMN had nothing but Ruin/Ruin 2 outside its DoTs and the only direct damaging aetherflow move WAS Fester (correction: energy drain was still around, but did was less potency), so being unable to actually use them meant that your rotation consisted of Ruin x infinity. I actually started going BLM in The Crystal tower raids BECAUSE I was getting annoyed at trying to play SMN in there.

Just because the dps checks in those alliance raids were basically non-existant didn't mean there weren't issues that were impacting people's fun of playing the jobs they like that relied on DoTs. There's a reason that issue got a lot of traction on the forums back in the day.