It's time (Option to Hide other players Glamour)

[Granyala]

If I was about to do a group activity for work and one of my coworkers shows up wearing a creepy frog costume, I will definitely make a remark and ask them to wear something less distracting.

Really?
We just had "Karneval" at our School. Lots of funky dresses, Boss dressed up as a clown, my colleague as a cat.

Work continued... despite the attire (though many chuckles were had).

People are way too easily distracted. Oo

[Theodric]

Because, like a lot of people in today's world, they are making an issue where one doesn't exist, or shouldn't exist and crying "muh immersions!". That ship sailed years ago.

I think it's very interesting that you keep trying to frame 'immersion' as the wildest thing to come out of this thread despite the fact that there's a group of very vocal players seeking to accuse people who want this feature as being 'bigots'. It's also interesting that you opt to use the word 'crying', too. Nobody is actually losing any sleep over this on the side of those advocating for it and all the lack of civility is entirely at the feet of some of those opposed to the idea.

[Barachim]

I feel like this GIF summarizes the entire Thread nicely.



That's essentially what it boils down to. One side would like to ignore Glamours for various reasons. Be it for the sake of immersion, personal taste, whatever. The main counter argument is pretty much "No, notice me!" The opposition seems mainly to exist because a number of people feel attacked on a personal level, because there could be others who do not care to see their carefully crafted glamours. The only valid argument I have seen so far, is that it might possibly not be feasible to implement with the current code. But no one can really say for certain until a dev actually voices his opinion on the matter.

[Gula]

I feel like this GIF summarizes the entire Thread nicely.



That's essentially what it boils down to. One side would like to ignore Glamours for various reasons. Be it for the sake of immersion, personal taste, whatever. The main counter argument is pretty much "No, notice me!" The opposition seems mainly to exist because a number of people feel attacked on a personal level, because there could be others who do not care to see their carefully crafted glamours. The only valid argument I have seen so far, is that it might possibly not be feasible to implement with the current code. But no one can really say for certain until a dev actually voices his opinion on the matter.

The response that would make me happiest would be, "It is possible, but we refuse." Because then some people wouldn't see Yoshi-P's Minfilia glam if he popped up in game.

[Lauront]

You are free to feel how you like but why the sudden 'outrage' now? FF12 had Fran in her lingerie, FF9 had the main villain in a pair of pants, Rikku wheres a bikini and Cloud spends part of FF7 in drag. Not like FF is doing anything new but folks are going to feel what they are going to feel.

It is not "outrage". The above might be things some people consider in poor taste, but not enough to deter them from playing the game, much like the situation here.

People are simply voicing a request for a feature to allow control over whether a glamour is displayed to them or not. Some people are, in turn, responding with the usual refrains regarding "muh bigotry, muh hate" and other hackneyed buzzwords.

I can at least somewhat respect objections to it from a resource standpoint, even if I would rather first hear from the devs on that front, but this kind of gratuitous name-calling serves little else but to poison the well and really fan the flames around the topic.

[Arngrim_Greyashe]

If I was about to do a group activity for work and one of my coworkers shows up wearing a creepy frog costume, I will definitely make a remark and ask them to wear something less distracting.

Maybe you should get over your need to police others, because that's sounding like a real "you" issue and not a "them" issue. People can do what they like, and if you don't like it, you go somewhere else.

I hate rap music. I don't go to a rap show and tell them to tailor their expression to my taste. Why? Because I'd get punched in the face, and rightfully so. I just don't go to said show. Because I know I don't like it.

[Kohl]

There are a lot of sticky things to consider when looking at a request for this kind of "option" from the corporate/business angle. One of them is ethics. I know that sounds like it is taking a video game "too seriously" but I am talking for the time being about the business angle of a product (which I assure you, SE takes their product seriously). It is a sticky, possibly ethically questionable, place for a company to put itself to adopt a function that could be seen as endorsing bigotry. Now, before you get all up in arms that I am calling anyone here a bigot for wanting an option, keep reading, because I am most specifically not. What I am pointing out that the code of ethics of many firms/company usually worded against unethical behavior or even behavior that has the appearance of being unethical; it isn't shady but it looks shady, so it is a violation. (/business stuff)

Argument points of saying it is for immersion: not having an option to filter glamours (mind you, the requested option was for a discrete filter: a filter that can be applied per player) is immersive. Again, NOT having the option is more immersive. It is the game as the developers present it is how you maintain immersion. The counter argument to this is that NOT having glamours is also more immersive. But that is almost a separate conversation/argument.

Argument points of saying there are "no reason to not have the option" are false, reasons have been stated and restated, not accepting an argument because it does not agree with your values does not make it invalid. By that token, it could be argued that there is no good reason to implement a filter option. However, I accept that it is genuinely distressing to see some glamours, it's a personally valid argument because it is factual. I do not think it outweighs the cons of implementing the option. The option to "blur" other players? Ok, no, time to play a single player game...

There are NPCs that wear costumes. The tall Fuath in Il Mheg. Adkiragh in Idyllshire. The Lalafell as a race itself are "silly" and cute even compared to Gnomes/Halflings of other games/fantasy franchises. Moogles, don't get me started!!! The silly parts of the Final Fantasy franchise is part of it. If you don't like the silliness than you are playing the wrong game. And I am saying this as a person that doesn't like the costumes (be it moogle, swine, frog, whatever... I dislike them). But I like FF, and that means growing to like the silly. There are glamours I get tired of seeing, but, it's not impacting my game play. If a game isn't supposed to be taken so seriously, why are things like this bothering people so much they want to block it? It's a game, stop taking that Hrothgar in a wedding dress so seriously.

I do use the filter to mute the battle effects for people not in my party. It is purely for the performance of my PC that could use an upgrade. I have suffered to watch many a hunt train kill a mark that wouldn't load on my screen until right before it de-spawned.

I'm all for options (get rid of gender-locks on races AND gear, everything dyeable, viera and hrothgar hair, more variation and options in character creation, the ability to have more options on your character proportions for male and female, some decent beards and facial hair options, some damned eyebrows for highlanders, more variation in character height, an option to include a few options from other races for that "half-elf" life, the ability to glamour DPS armor onto my Tank, or Healer for that battle cleric look, optional secondary arms: like a staff for MNK... etc). There are so many other, game enriching, options that should be a priority for demand than a filter that could put SE in hot water. There is no end of people who love to talk about how modern media is rotting everyone's brains... someone is going to make an issue of it.

[Lauront]

Really?
We just had "Karneval" at our School. Lots of funky dresses, Boss dressed up as a clown, my colleague as a cat.

Work continued... despite the attire (though many chuckles were had).

People are way too easily distracted. Oo

Yes, those things are what you call "special occasions". It is generally understood people won't show up to work in a way that totally contravenes a workplace's dress code, though.

Maybe you should get over your need to police others, because that's sounding like a real "you" issue and not a "them" issue. People can do what they like, and if you don't like it, you go somewhere else.

I hate rap music. I don't go to a rap show and tell them to tailor their expression to my taste. Why? Because I'd get punched in the face, and rightfully so. I just don't go to said show. Because I know I don't like it.

...what's that got to do with what he said, regarding his workplace?

[Theodric]

Maybe you should get over your need to police others, because that's sounding like a real "you" issue and not a "them" issue. People can do what they like, and if you don't like it, you go somewhere else.

His point isn't at all unreasonable. Especially since, in a work environment, a degree of professionalism is required. The degree varies, though a guy in a frog costume would be extremely distracting in pretty much any job outside of some very niche situations like working as a mascot.

I realise that a lot of people playing this game may not necessarily be familiar with the working world and etiquette associated with it though, so I can understand the confusion to a degree.

[Lauront]

So because they want to protect their feelings they think it's justified to insult and prevent others from asking a prefectly reasonable suggestion? A suggestion, that, mind you, will have absolutely no side effect on the game and player's experience whatsoever. It's exactly the same as hiding the battle effects of other people. It's entirely optional, it doesn't not affect other people's experience and if you don't publicaly announce it noone will even know about it. And most importantly 99% of people don't give a damn.

Having the developers spend time on making stuff like dresses wearable by males, a feature that 99.9% of the population will not use, is somehow fine and applauded, while the the same time those very same people that asked for the dresses are waging such a huge campaign against this request, which will probably be used by much more people and that doesn't affect them in any way, is the very definition of double standards and forcing your values down the throat of other people. [...]

Yes, the way resource constraints are completely shoved to the side concerning matters where some imagined "moral imperative" exists, and yet here they're front and centre, is rather intriguing. I think you hit the nail on the head about what is motivating some of the accusations of "bigotry".