Paladin feels miles ahead of the other tanks in terms of overall play in this game.

[Noitems]

Divine Veil gives 10% of the Paladin's skyhigh health pool as a shield. Shake It Off at baseline gives 15% of the target's much lower HP, not the Warrior's. They're roughly equal if WAR burns no cooldowns, but Veil needs the heal requirement removed by now. If you think Veil isn't significant you've probably never gotten to attacks like Light of Judgement in O8S a group mitigation rotation to barely survive.

What Paladin's utility really excels at is double tankbusters, which were everywhere last patch and there's at least a few in E5S (Add and Ramuh often do tankbusters simultaneously). Otherwise it's okay at everything but not amazing in any aspect besides the one mentioned.

Shake It Off does give 15% Warrior's Max HP. So already it's better then Veil and that number can be pushed significantly if just Thrill is used since that raises your max HP by 20% which then Thrill gets boosted by 17% of your new max hp. Hell Shake and Thrill share the same CD time pretty much for that reason since they're great in tandem.

Paladin does make life easier by generally having the normal heals proc Veil, but I wouldn't disregard or downplay WAR for that reason.

[RadicalPesto]

Shake It Off does give 15% Warrior's Max HP.

I believe this has been tested and its simply not true, even the tooltip is worded differently than Veil.

[Noitems]

I believe this has been tested and its simply not true, even the tooltip is worded differently than Veil.

The only difference is that Veil states the word "Your" which considering that tip is using Yalms was written long ago and never edited down. They should both should have the same meaning even if WAR's doesn't state it specifically since it doesn't imply a target for the Max HP.

Looking at Thrill's wording it also is done in a similar way to Shake implying it's your health as well.

[Aurelius2625]

Shake It Off does give 15% Warrior's Max HP. So already it's better then Veil and that number can be pushed significantly if just Thrill is used since that raises your max HP by 20% which then Thrill gets boosted by 17% of your new max hp. Hell Shake and Thrill share the same CD time pretty much for that reason since they're great in tandem.

Paladin does make life easier by generally having the normal heals proc Veil, but I wouldn't disregard or downplay WAR for that reason.

You're wrong on several counts.

First: Warrior's Thrill does NOT get calculated in Shake's hp percentage value, that's because Shake goes off of the TARGET'S HP VALUE otherwise Shake would be pretty OP. Warrior's Shake, if you bothered to read the actual tooltip, shields the target based off of their OWN HP. That's why Shake was buffed, PLD's Veil gives MORE shielding for free, WAR needs to buff theirs to meet it in value.

Warrior can spend Thrill, Raw, and Vengeance for 2 percent more shield per CD consumed.

PLD's shield is based off of the PLD's hp, which is about 14k shielding right now, which is pretty good. Compare that to the 12 percent of like a BLM's 80k hp... not nearly as good, but, it's totally instant to cast so there's that.

Also to clear something up because these forums love to be in the dark about basic skills and tooltips and how things work on tanking, but love to give their "advice". Passage of Arms can be instantly weaved in between GCD's to give the 15 percent mitigation to all dmg, this persists on the server tick, so you get about 5 seconds worth of mitigation, more than enough if timed correctly to lose no dps, so no the "Raid" as someone pointed out, does NOT "lose a lot of dps".

Another thing: Intervention is OP as hell. It's a FREE 10 percent on your cotank at nearly all times when it's necessary. You can keep spamming it as long as you are not actively being auto'd as you will have your other CDs up for w/e you need them for. That, and if there is a double buster you can buff it by having Sentinel or Ramp up for even more OP mitigation. That's insane, no other tank can do nearly as much for their cotank as PLD can for free. TBN is great, but it costs resource and if the DRK already has their DA proc, they ain't using it again till raid buffs are up or they need to refresh DRKside/spend mana.

Cover kind of blows now, but hopefully they have dps/healer mechs where u can use that like in O7s with the missiles.

The real brokenness of Veil: You can pop it a FULL MINUTE before it is needed, yes, so long as your healers are going to put something up to proc it, you can pop it 30s before that, so it goes on CD, then, the shield lasts for a full 30s again, that's INSANE. No other tank can do that... at all. You can have so much uptime on veil it's outrageous. double the uses of it than the other tanks stuff.

[Nedkel]

Also to clear something up because these forums love to be in the dark about basic skills and tooltips and how things work on tanking, but love to give their "advice". Passage of Arms can be instantly weaved in between GCD's to give the 15 percent mitigation to all dmg, this persists on the server tick, so you get about 5 seconds worth of mitigation, more than enough if timed correctly to lose no dps, so no the "Raid" as someone pointed out, does NOT "lose a lot of dps".

Can be instantly weaved, but GNB and DRK equivalent is still a lot better for party wide damage, you wont miss anyone with it and those have 90 sec cooldown instead of 120 sec.

Another thing: Intervention is OP as hell. It's a FREE 10 percent on your cotank at nearly all times when it's necessary. You can keep spamming it as long as you are not actively being auto'd as you will have your other CDs up for w/e you need them for. That, and if there is a double buster you can buff it by having Sentinel or Ramp up for even more OP mitigation. That's insane, no other tank can do nearly as much for their cotank as PLD can for free. TBN is great, but it costs resource and if the DRK already has their DA proc, they ain't using it again till raid buffs are up or they need to refresh DRKside/spend mana.

Intervention comes in with dimishing returns spared with 20% damage reduction comes down to 8% effectively and 7% if the cotank used 30% mitigation.
Also warrior has 10% reduction on nascent flash AND heals on top of that, so ehm nope.
Gnb has 15% reduction you could use on party member as well, DRK could cast TBN which is the strongest mitigation skill in game.

Cover kind of blows now, but hopefully they have dps/healer mechs where u can use that like in O7s with the missiles.

Cover is useful but you have to be careful when you use it, because you may receive too much damage with it when both you and target is getting damaged. In result this skill is not useful everywhere and could do more bad than good.

The real brokenness of Veil: You can pop it a FULL MINUTE before it is needed, yes, so long as your healers are going to put something up to proc it, you can pop it 30s before that, so it goes on CD, then, the shield lasts for a full 30s again, that's INSANE. No other tank can do that... at all. You can have so much uptime on veil it's outrageous. double the uses of it than the other tanks stuff.

First, not full minute but 30 seconds.
Second, there is literally no chance that you as a tank wont be given some kind of party wide regen in the time and that you cannot guarantee it will proc in the needed moment. Activating this skill is a nightmare and could sometimes not proc the shield at all. Shake it of is still better.

I think their argument is that it shouldn't be the case that a tank has the ability to solo heal itself through most instanced content. They should have to rely on healer.
I think there may be some (older) dungeons with neglible healing needs that could be done more efficiently with 1 PLD and 3 dps.

This holds no value in the end game.

[Satarn]

snip

Funny how you mention diminishing returns on Intervention, but somehow "GNB and DRK equivalent is still a lot better" than Veil that suffers none of these. Also Veil has had 90 second cd ever since 5.0, on top of the fact that PLD has another raid mitigation skill - another mitigation skill which will not suffer diminishing returns when stacked together with Veil if you so choose. Have you played PLD?

It is also true that Veil can be used - and therefore put on cd to be reused earlier - almost 60 seconds in advance. You have 30 seconds to pop it and then another 30 of the shield itself. It might be a stretch that you could hold it that long realistically, but it still offers way more room than any other raidwide.
It's only "a nightmare" if you're playing in completely unorganized DF content - where honestly it's a miracle if tanks use any mitigation at all, be it raid or personal - so who cares anyways.

Suggesting PLD's utility is anywhere close to bad is as laughable as claiming that DRK has bad personal mitigation. Those are things these jobs specifically excel at - saying otherwise just shows the person is simply bad at utilizing their tool-kits.