FFXIV is just FFTA from the other perspective

[SannaR]

During HW many people became even more suspicious of Hydaelyn when she took over Minfilia's body. She knew of Y'shotola's Flow spell and asked Minfilia to go that area since it will take her to the Aetherial Sea. There Minfilia was alone and under a lot of stress when she eventually agreed to become the Word of the Mother. Granted, it was all Minfilia's decision.

It also doesn't help that the artwork at that time had Hydaelyn looking rather ominous with the chains she has wrapped around Minfilia.

I mean she was so weak she lost the ability to speak with anyone with the echo and not have it get choppy. She reached out to a person she sensed was near the flow spell and who was a very firm believer in her. That's not shady that's a person choosing to do something out of blind faith.

[SannaR]

No, Hydaelyn hasn't done anything 'bad' so far, but she has willingly withheld truths from us. Another thing is the fact that apparently she knew how the First suffered, but only stepped in when Arbert showed up, almost as if to assure us she's still the good one. So, shady in my book.

And what the post above me said.

If she's too weak to speak to us to the point she has to ask Minfilia to become her voice what makes you think she was strong enough to be fully aware of what's going on the shards? Sure we didn't fully know at that time that the 1st was the opposite of the 13th and it was easier to defeat the Ascians and tilted to the light. Also would you really want her to sit ya down the first time she talks to you and give you a whole history as to why you have to fight on her behalf? Concerning most at least on the Source didn't and still might not be aware of her existence? Hydaelyn has had to recover from not only seven calamities, but a sundering and saving our bacon once. It's like if Hydaelyn was playing a you have only X minutes to get to safety parts of a game where even the random fights you get into keeps the clock running. There isn't really any time to sit down every WoL that's facing one of the 7 calamities and get all heeey I'm the will of the star ect so would you kindly do your best to stop these guys. Since she would have to have that talk with the source and shard Wol(s).

[Theodric]

I have my doubts that Hydaelyn is 'weak'. It seems like a convenient excuse for her to hide her misdeeds. She's been evasive on every front, robbed the Warrior of Light of a close friend and showed immense bias towards those who have the Echo. Let's not forget that she has only ever intervened to save the Warrior of Light and Krile, leaving everybody else on the Isle of Val to perish. That isn't reflective of somebody who supposedly loves all of her children. Then, of course, there's the element of her having done very little to aid the other Stars. Which she is responsible for creating in the first place.

Either way, she isn't a deity but a Primal and it is time to put the reins of history back in the hands of man. That'd be a step towards allowing everybody to prosper and not just those who happen to be given the Echo/Blessing of Light.

[MikkoAkure]

snip.

You seem really oddly persistent on believing that Hydaelyn is a malevolent figure. Hydaelyn is indeed a primal, but she never tempered anyone like Zodiark has, and doesn’t suck the planet dry of aether, which is why she’s weak.

She isn’t telling us everything up front because we don’t necessarily need to know. She doesn’t exist to help us with everything, otherwise there would be no point in life. Warriors of Light (who exist on the shards as well as the Source) seem to only gain her blessing and strength only when Ascians are causing a ruckus. Ascians are sort of an outside problem that goes against the normal course of life and why she gets involved personally.

If you pay attention to the lyrics of Answers, she’s not an involved Goddess whose purpose is to make us happy. To her, suffering and death is part of life and that’s part of what makes it beautiful. I’m of the mind that as soon as the Ascian threat is gone, there will be no more Echo, no more Warriors of Light, and life will continue on without her involvement, just like how she never got involved in the Dragonsong War.

[Theodric]

There's nothing odd about it. It's a matter of perspective. She may very well not be malevolent but she's certainly incompetent due to how she accidentally sundered all life in her battle with Zodiark. It's possible that she's not weak at all and is simply reluctant to use her power since it would only serve to fracture everything all over again. There's plenty of unintended consequences associated with the sundering - which the writers themselves have stated as an unstable, bad state for things to be in. Add to that the recent revelations in regards to Ultima having taken on a form inspired by Hydaelyn, Eureka revealing that it might be possible to create a new crystal and The Qitana Ravel revealing that Hydaelyn is not a deity but a Primal...there's plenty of evidence suggesting that she is unworthy of the high praise and trust that she receives in the form of blind faith. Even the Scions have expressed their doubt towards Hydaelyn.

As for death being 'beautiful', I disagree. Especially when there's a stark disparity between how long the likes of dragons live compared to mortals. Especially when mortals also used to be exceptionally long lived/immortal until Hydaelyn weakened them considerably.

She should be upfront about the circumstances rather than evasive. Mankind deserve to know the truth of their origins, after all - though as it paints Hydaelyn in a poor light, it would seem she deliberately avoided mentioning it. Strange!

At any rate, we'll likely see more plot revelations relating to Zodiark and Hydaelyn during the next two patches. I think the best stance to take is cautious neutrality, as there's no reason to fully condemn or blindly support either of them at this point in time. I suspect the bigger threat is going to be whatever is responsible for causing the mysterious sound that destroyed the original planet - some sort of Jenova type entity, perhaps.

[LineageRazor]

I have my doubts that Hydaelyn is 'weak'.

It is not just Hydaelyn claiming that she is weak. Lahabrea explicitly (and quite smugly) speaks of her weakness, as well. I'd say that insinuating that she's feigning weakness as part of her diabolical plot is grasping at a pretty thin straw!

As for her misdeeds, EVERYTHING in your first paragraph aside from being evasive can be chalked up to being weak. So, your evidence that she's not actually weak... is that she behaves as if she's weak?

[Theodric]

It is not just Hydaelyn claiming that she is weak. Lahabrea explicitly (and quite smugly) speaks of her weakness, as well. I'd say that insinuating that she's feigning weakness as part of her diabolical plot is grasping at a pretty thin straw!

As for her misdeeds, EVERYTHING in your first paragraph aside from being evasive can be chalked up to being weak. So, your evidence that she's not actually weak... is that she behaves as if she's weak?

She's lied and deliberately withheld key information that would have resulted in lives not being lost. She also played a part in destroying a peaceful civilisation. People are free to put blind faith in her if they so choose, though the narrative is set up in such a way that questioning Hydaelyn is very much a viable option.

A lot of people are treating her as though she is a goddess and a deity, even after we now know that such is false. She's a Primal - and by their very nature they are deceptive (or even benevolent but still a threat due to operating in a way that causes harm to others either directly or indirectly).

Though Lahabrea's speech is interesting given that he specifically deems her to be a parasite and a threat to the very existence of the Star itself.

[SannaR]

I think the whole point of the sundering was to make sure the 13 couldn't summon Zodiark ever again, but Hydaelyn for whatever reason didn't have enough strength or Aether or whatnot to split up everyone thus the three of them somehow survived it. Along with making her the will of the star and having people forget so that they wont be tempted to try and summon her. I mean why else does she seem fine with no one worshiping her all the time? She doesn't tap into non echo bearers and go hey worship me and do my bidding or else. Heck she doesn't even do that with those with the echo. We don't know how much energy it takes to recover from not only the sundering, but each of the calamities as well. Both her and the Ascians have said that the chaos they've been creating has been a constant thing. Yes, it's takes seemingly a few thousand years to cause enough chaos we still are dealing with beings who have lived a long time so their perception of time is different than ours. Yet during the Allagan Empire they pulled one off while setting up another one.

[Alleo]

Though Lahabrea's speech is interesting given that he specifically deems her to be a parasite and a threat to the very existence of the Star itself.

Lahabrea called Zodiark also the one true god in the cutscenes, strange since they should know that he is no true god. And of course he would see her as a threat since she split the original world and keeps Zodiark in a prison.

And remember that Yoshida himself stated that we should wait until we get her point of view and not just already jugde her as bad just because Emet said so.

What key information did she withhold? What lifes were lost because of that? Also we simply dont even know how much power she has over shards. Maybe she cant simply do stuff her and need an emissary (kinda like Zodiark has Elidibus). What peaceful civilisation did she destroy? The ancient ones who were at conflict beforehand thanks to Zodiark and the intended sacrifice? And unlike Zodiark she at least kept the people alive, even if they split.

And yes I will keep my faith in her, because right now she might not have been all perfectly good but that does not suddenly make her bad. Its all about nuance and not dealing in absolutes after all.

Also shouldnt it be great that she does not hold our hands at every step on the way (if she even has enough power left to do so)? I mean isnt it all about humanity having their fate in their own hands? Then why want her help? She is doing exactly what some want. Only helping when its absolute necessary but otherwise not forcing our ways.

[Theodric]

The relevant lore elements have been pointed out numerous times, including within this very thread. I'd suggest simply agreeing to disagree on the matter, since as we know the development team have stated in interviews that such things are a matter of perspective and that the sundered worlds are in an unstable state. Suggesting that Hydaelyn is far from perfect should not be a controversial point.

Luckily we can take immense comfort in the success of Shadowbringers. On a narrative front alone it has been a great success and we can safely predict more shades of grey and complex nuances moving forward. Outside of Zenos, at least - but he has been deliberately designed to lack any redeeming qualities.