Struggling as Healer on Wall-to-Walls

[CrimsonGunner]

Lol, thinks i'm the one derailing the thread when I gave my advice to OP and someone wants to be snide and make a false assumption on page 2, so I responded in turn to correct their idiocy, and then you wanting to butt in. But whatever, always blame the healer right? lmao.

stop with the venom and take a break to breath and calm down.
you act like people here blame you for your "lack" of skill but read their comments with a calmer tune and voice. they aren't here to little you or to claim they are superior ,im sure they aren't elitist or even judge you for doing "poorly" at healing.(i am definitely neither elitist or probably that good)
however they do judge you due to the venom you throw at them cause i believe they never said their advice in a condescending or any harmful way but rather actually try to help the op and you and give you the advice that helps them most of the time and probably had the same feeling as you at one point and those advice's helped them during those times.

as for your problem:
you say u cant get better with practice, then review your actions and read your skills to get a better understanding also stop acting like your solo in the world, there's a reason there are 2 healers in mt. gulg

if you see no improvement in practice ,then go over what you do with someone and check what the source of your problem.maybe its your controls so go over you settings,maybe you mistime your skills ,could be your gear for the content(maybe missing stats),mp management all can be the reasons why u feel your stuck or maybe even more that aren't listed but again you need to check with someone so you will have a different perspective.

as for the combo advices, try to check and implement them(if your not already doing that) like benison+regen its a good thing.keeping regen always also helps as well as sometimes using cure rather then cure II all the time cause cure cast is faster and even though its 450 potency sometimes speed is better then quantity.

as for big pulls ,you shouldn't look for 100% hp just have his hp above danger zone, feel the damage rate the tank gets and see how much he usually receive each second/hit and adjust to that, his hp just need to be high enough to survive the hit rate.

read this comment however you want but my comment isn't coming from a "high place" but from a true intent on helping the op and you.

[MikuMitsuko]

Apologies for not being able to reply quicker/individually but thank you all for the advice! I'm actually noticing an improvement on my WHM in lvl 80 dungeons. Only had to use Cures to heal the dps on the second and last bosses in Twinning a couple times. I didn't really feel overly stressed about the tank's hp.

So I guess my problem (for WHM at least) was proper skill usage/timing and gear. Got some melds to help until I can get my Eden gear (I didn't know melds were so important lol). I'm using regen and the afflatus skills more now - in particular afflatus rapture, I didn't know the radius was so large I think I relied too much on Tetra and Benison and forgot all about my lilies before. Being able to weave in oGCDs between heals using lilies is making a big difference.

As for SCH, I'm going to try it in a few 80 dungeons and see if I'm still trash, lol

[Numenor1379]

Apologies for not being able to reply quicker/individually but thank you all for the advice! I'm actually noticing an improvement on my WHM in lvl 80 dungeons. Only had to use Cures to heal the dps on the second and last bosses in Twinning a couple times. I didn't really feel overly stressed about the tank's hp.

So I guess my problem (for WHM at least) was proper skill usage/timing and gear. Got some melds to help until I can get my Eden gear (I didn't know melds were so important lol). I'm using regen and the afflatus skills more now - in particular afflatus rapture, I didn't know the radius was so large I think I relied too much on Tetra and Benison and forgot all about my lilies before. Being able to weave in oGCDs between heals using lilies is making a big difference.

As for SCH, I'm going to try it in a few 80 dungeons and see if I'm still trash, lol

Glad to hear it. =)

Also don't worry too much if you do have to use your GCD heals. That is what they are there for, and often if the Tank pulls fast/the dungeon has enough pulls you're going to run out of oGCDs. Just get used to those Afflatus skills... I had an 85k Misery hit earlier today and damn does it feel good. XD

[Rilifane]

Aside from the things HyoMin already mentioned for AST, a few additional tips:

• When placing Earthly Star I found it generally better to place it at the last mob group while everyone is still running towards it. Once the aoe effects and telegraphs are all over the place, it's difficult to spot so placing it beforehand makes it easier for the tank to see plus it nets you a few free seconds for the star to grow.
  I had WAY less tanks standing outside the Star or needing to detonate it sooner after I started doing this.

• Horoscope in combination with Asp. Helios is pretty strong overall, though initially weaker compared to ED/ BeneII single target. Asp. Helios is overall 700 potency + 400 from Horoscope with the Horoscope healing being on-demand for 30sec. Two birds with one stone if you also had a dps eating an aoe.

• Synastry is pretty strong even if you don't have to spot heal others or constantly spam BeneII. It's a free 40% on single target heals. Better to use it for only a few heals than not at all. Depending on the dps I often find myself using it towards the end of the pull when most options are either exhausted or better kept off cooldown for the next pull and several mobs are still punching the tank. Quickly spam him back up in one go and commence Gravity spam.
  If shit hits the fan, I use it sooner to get everything back under control.
  My biggest mistake was waiting for too long to use it and then feeling pressured to heal spam like mad.

• Collective Unconscious hot lasts for the full 18sec while the dmg reduce lasts for 5sec if you cancel the channel right away. While not incredibly strong it's a free hot + a bit mitigation. I usually quickly push it while sliding through the tank when I have to reposition myself because of aoes. But you can also try to stay near the tank or use the mobility from Light's Speed to position yourself.

• Use Celestial Intersection as often as possible during a pull. It's free 600 potency (200 heal + 400 shield). Even if it's not up in time to stack it with Noct Asp. Benefic before the next pull starts, you can always shield on the run between two groups once the tank tapped everything.

• Don't forget Swiftcast. Wether to cast a quick BeneII on the run if the tank took more damage than expected while pulling, throwing out a quick Asp. Helios while dodging aoes or something else, it's not worth holding back in case the tank dies and you need to raise him because it's highly unlikely you'll survive if that happened.

My strategy for AST is often:
pre-shielding pulls with Noct Asp. Benefic + Diurnal Celestial Intersection -> placing the star on the run -> Asp. Benefic on tank + Horoscope -> Asp. Helios -> Gravity spam.
The star will detonate around the time when the tank first drops even with hots up. Using Celestial Opposition right away on top of that is usually too much as almost every tank starts with his strongest def CD.
After the Star detonated (or I detonated it manually) I use Celestial Opposition between Gravitys, reapply Asp. Benefic + Celestial Intersection and continue Gravity spam.
Essential Dignity and the Horoscope on-demand healing as neccessary. Letting the tank drop a little for higher ED potency and following it with Horoscope works pretty well. Celestial Intersection whenever it's up.
Neutral Sect is up every other pull and I try to align it with the biggest pulls of the dungeon but as long as it's up for the next bigger pull, I use it.
Collective Unconscious whenever possible and Synastry sooner or later in a pull, depending a bit on the dmg pattern. But that's something where I improvise. It all depends on the damage pattern.
This is just one example and while it works fairly well for me and I got better and better dps uptime with cards flying left and right, there isn't really THE one way to use your oGCDs.
Use everything regulary but don't stack too much at once so you're not out of options half-way into a pull. Experiment a little with what works best for you.

It took a bit of practice to still throw cards while handling large pulls but the constant dps increase definitely helps aswell. Dead mobs can't punch the tank. But as HyoMin said: don't stress it. If you can do it, great. But focus first on getting a firm hold on your various oGCD heals to keep the tank alive with minimal BeneII spam and increased dps uptime.
Weaving cards is way easier if you're just spamming Gravity/ Malefic because the tank is stable enough to dps.
I generally try to fish for seals more towards the end of the pull so I have Divination + Lord/ Lady up right at the start of the next big pull when most dps use their own dps cds aswell.

And while stance dancing might feel clunky at first and may lead to some stressful situations at first when you got locked, I really recommend practicing it.
Both shields add up for 20-30% of the tank HP, depending on crit luck. Having the tank arrive at the last group with half HP adds a lot of pressure and often forces you to heal inefficiently in order to stabilize the tank, messing up your oGCD usage.

[Shurrikhan]

And my gear is ilvl 437-ish on my SCH and WHM. I can't find a gear guide for anything that doesn't involve savage/EX gear (which I don't have because I'm bad) so I'm not very optimized, either.

Apologies if this is really noob-ish, I've only been playing for a few months and the community in-game is honestly not very helpful.

None of the current dungeons should give you any significant trouble with a decent tank after you and they are each i430+. That's not to say that every tank that will attempt wall-to-wall pulls will be decent tank, however.

I can only really give significant advice on WHM, sadly:

• Make sure to prep with Benison and Regen. Benison should be used nearly on cooldown as soon as it's mitigation will not waste ticks of Regen.
• Weave your oGCDs where possible. Regen offers you a very easy way to weave two oGCDs, and then maintaining some margin of Lily skills can allow you further gaps for weaving oGCDs when using them.
• You can get up to a 30% stronger Regen (50% on WAR) via Assylum and Temperance.
• Temperance doubles as a tank mitigation CD. Even if you only end up using it on a single Regen, it's still quite worth having it up after Holy spam.
• Because Holy costs so little more than your regular skills and your mana is so nearly infinite even without using Thin Air, feel free to put up Thin Air later when you have space to weave it.

:: I therefore tend to open with Regen, reapplying it before the tank has reached the end of the pull, DoTing mobs as we sprint past, with Benison being applied as soon as it (or Regen) won't go at all to waste. (If your tank refuses to Sprint, feel free to run ahead of them, Holy, and then catch up and Swift-Holy to keep mobs off them as they gather them for the full pull so that Regen remains sufficient for finishing the gather.) I then open with Holy spam until I need my first Solace*, then weave in Temperance and Assylum before Regen, then Lucid and Thin Air. As the fight goes on and tank and healer CDs bottom out, you'll probably have to throw out some Cure IIs, but that's perfectly fine; just don't deny the tank the direct (stun) and indirect mitigation (mobs dying sooner) of your Holy spam before you need to. (*Improvise slightly or accept the lost uptime if you don't have Lilies available for that first Solace.)

[Schan]

Nice assumption, but no I have never received healing advice in an instance. My hostility stems from this forum feeling more like an elitist circlejerk where everyone here laughs at people less skilled than they are and then just go git gud. They don't try to see or understand how difficult things may actually be for someone like me, despite explaining over and over and over and over to them, so eventually it becomes tiresome and people wonder why someone gets jaded at a community.

Are we like... reading the same forum? i tend to lurk here and very rarely i see people making fun of others because they're less skilled. We have our arguments but i don't remember reading people making fun of others recently.

I think you may be having a bad day and/or misplacing your hostility. Not saying that people don't do that kind of stuff since... people be people... but I didn't sense any mockery out of the replies with advice.
I would like to remind you that when reading something the "tone" is in your brain. You can read the same sentence in a neutral way or a sarcastic way. it depends on the mindset.

Regarding healing everything has been convered already. The only thing i would like to add is that sometimes you can use your full kit and the tank will still go down. Even though you are the healer, everyone can help you by making it easier by not getting hit by avoidable damage or using their kits so they won't take as much damage.

It's fine if you ask tanks to do smaller pulls. be it because you don't trust yourself or you don't trust the random people Duty Finder just got together or you know you aren't good at it. It's fine. I'm no good at healing either but i still like it and screw it however gives me s%^" over my healing. I'm trying my best and that's what matters.

edit: can i just say AST-wise since people like have mentioned Horoscope I would like to mention a couple of things:
I sometimes use it without using Helios to make it stronger since the cooldown is pretty short
I prefer to make it strong and i will do so when i'm stacking heals over time on the tank. You can use the single target heal of time, the pop horoscope, use the aoe heal over time and now you have an empowered horoscope while not "wasting" skills.

This is just a playstyle kind of thing since i hate using AoE healing when i'm trying to get the tank up since they are usually weaker heals and if the tank requires a lot of healing (because reasons) you're better off using bene II.

(also swiftcast can be your friend. don't save it just for the rezzes, but if things are bad enough for you to have to rely on swiftcast... then saving it for the rez won't matter either)

[Sloprano]

Apologies for not being able to reply quicker/individually but thank you all for the advice! I'm actually noticing an improvement on my WHM in lvl 80 dungeons. Only had to use Cures to heal the dps on the second and last bosses in Twinning a couple times. I didn't really feel overly stressed about the tank's hp.

So I guess my problem (for WHM at least) was proper skill usage/timing and gear. Got some melds to help until I can get my Eden gear (I didn't know melds were so important lol). I'm using regen and the afflatus skills more now - in particular afflatus rapture, I didn't know the radius was so large I think I relied too much on Tetra and Benison and forgot all about my lilies before. Being able to weave in oGCDs between heals using lilies is making a big difference.

As for SCH, I'm going to try it in a few 80 dungeons and see if I'm still trash, lol

Best of luck, keep doing dungeons and you'll start to notice you handle big pulls and triage naturally as you learn to gauge how much each skill heals. If in need of a refresher, I like to stand in place in front of a training dummy for a while just using every singe skill so I know I can reach it comfortably and fast if needs be. Both getting to know where the button is without looking and getting a feel of how long until next time you can use it.

Always remember it's a team effort going through, reading up and playing as other roles can help your healing knowing what skills they have, what the buffs look like and how often they can use them. Like tank's invulns, self-healing and dps's various support skills.

[Makeda]

At 437 iLevel... normal eden is actually easier than expert roulette.

Expert roulette will give you two kinds if tanks:

• Chain pulls because they way outgear it and just assume everyone else does as well by this point.
• Just got to 80 and is also at iLevel 437 so can barely handle even the single pulls.

Eden normal is going to be just one mob, with a timer on its attacks so even in less gear you can predict when the heavy hits are coming. You will see half your group moving to spots an few seconds ahead of time because they know what’s coming... the other half are constantly getting slammed because they’re new to it. Just pick someone who seems confident and follow them...
- that will quickly get you sone iLevel 450s

Hint: use world visit to check every MB on your data center. I geared 3 jobs to 450+ and a 4th at 444 because some of Crystal’s realms sell for 4-8 times LESS than others...

The tips people have had here will help with expert, but expert won’t be casually easy unless you outgear it AND your rank both outgears it and uses proper mitigation. You need all 3 of those until maybe 445+, and only by 450+ will it be easy even with an undergeared tank that fails mitigation...

Eden normal got easy for me to almost solo heal by 440 just because I learned the “dance” as I got to farm with it on both dancer and gunbreaker before bringing my scholar. Actually isn’t 440 the minimum iLevel anyway, or is that the min for savage? If it is, one trip to the marketboard will get you there if you buy smart.

Normal raids are about the dance (when they’re current content that is)...

Expert dungeons meed gear... just not as much gear as ex trial or savage raid.
- also, the easiest role to play in Titania ex is healer... literally just hold big heals for tank busters and top the tank off between little pick hits and collect loot...

At level 80 Titania ex was hard for me on tank and DPS but on SCH it was the easiest level 80 instanced content the game had... almost on par with an open world fate.

[ForteNightshade]

Apologies for not being able to reply quicker/individually but thank you all for the advice! I'm actually noticing an improvement on my WHM in lvl 80 dungeons. Only had to use Cures to heal the dps on the second and last bosses in Twinning a couple times. I didn't really feel overly stressed about the tank's hp.

So I guess my problem (for WHM at least) was proper skill usage/timing and gear. Got some melds to help until I can get my Eden gear (I didn't know melds were so important lol). I'm using regen and the afflatus skills more now - in particular afflatus rapture, I didn't know the radius was so large I think I relied too much on Tetra and Benison and forgot all about my lilies before. Being able to weave in oGCDs between heals using lilies is making a big difference.

As for SCH, I'm going to try it in a few 80 dungeons and see if I'm still trash, lol

That's fantastic to hear!

I can really only echo what others have said save for try not to stress should things go awry. In my experiences, people are pretty forgiving if you're quick to point out a mistake you've made. Even more experienced players make mistakes too. Keep practicing and it'll feel second nature before long.

[Naoki34]

(Sorry if there's a better place to put this)

I'm having a hard time with wall-to-walls on all 3 healers in ShB dungeons. Everyone says it's easy, they can do it undergeared and still dps etc etc but even with okay-ish gear I end up blowing my oGCDs and having to resort to GCD spamming 85% of the time. Especially SCH, I have to GCD spam almost every single time on it because I'm so bad at managing Aetherflow.

I even looked up the Balance guide for wall pull healing (for SCH) but I still struggle. And it's not the tanks' fault, either - they have good gear and use their cooldowns correctly most of the time.
Is there a guide on healing wall pulls? Or a video of someone doing it the right way?

And my gear is ilvl 437-ish on my SCH and WHM. I can't find a gear guide for anything that doesn't involve savage/EX gear (which I don't have because I'm bad) so I'm not very optimized, either.

Apologies if this is really noob-ish, I've only been playing for a few months and the community in-game is honestly not very helpful.

Running is good for health.