Does Elidibus actually think he can defeat the WoL?

[Alleo]

One possible reason is that people are becoming aware of the Ascians and what they are doing. They've manage to remain mysterious and manipulative for twelve thousand years, but the current generation is discovering an alarming amount about them - including the ability to destroy them. What comes next? The ability to hunt them down into the rift between, perhaps, where until now they've been completely safe? It could be that Elidibus is now seeing the writing on the wall, and realizes that if he doesn't wrap things up soon, orchestrating future manipulations could become nigh-impossible.

One flaw with this angle is the Allagans. Since they were technically advanced enough to do basically anything, it seems likely they would have figured out the Ascians, what they were up to, and how to deal with them. Or, perhaps, the Ascians were just extra careful during that period, and in the current era were sloppy (perhaps arrogantly assuming that if the Allagans couldn't bring them down, no backwater civilizations like those that followed could possibly be a threat).

Of course they might be afraid that more people know about them but at the same time even the scions are more passive than active when it comes to hunting Ascians. We only killed Emet because he actively stood against us, and we never before hunted them down. (The only one who does that is Gaius but we dont even know if he just kills the host or if he truly kills them) Why not wait a few hundred years without causing much chaos and suddenly they might become just myths, boogeymen that in the view of people might have never existed at all. And then they could start again.

Even if he waited, we always come back. Emet mentioned that in every age, someone rises up to try to stop them. I am willing to bet that it is the soul of the 14th. Hydaelyn's summoner and champion.

But the problem is that Hydealyn seemingly grows weaker and weaker, so who knows if we would come back as powerful all the time. She even risked losing more of her own power to shield us from Ultima, an act that is either done because of her love for us or maybe because she knows that we cant have more failures. Because everytime someone stood up to them they also seemingly always failed because the calamities still happened. So this life is probably the first one that really gets dangerous to them. But killing us like Elidibus plans just means that we will be back. So why not wait and plan in the shadows for another calamity and then do it when we died of old age. Because even if we are reborn right after we died we would be a baby and could not harm them.

[Riastrad]

But the problem is that Hydealyn seemingly grows weaker and weaker, so who knows if we would come back as powerful all the time. She even risked losing more of her own power to shield us from Ultima, an act that is either done because of her love for us or maybe because she knows that we cant have more failures. Because everytime someone stood up to them they also seemingly always failed because the calamities still happened. So this life is probably the first one that really gets dangerous to them. But killing us like Elidibus plans just means that we will be back. So why not wait and plan in the shadows for another calamity and then do it when we died of old age. Because even if we are reborn right after we died we would be a baby and could not harm them.

That is a fair point. However, each time our past selves failed and a calamity came and went, it stands to reason then as Zodiark grows stronger so would Hydaelyn as more aether seeps into the Source. However, we see she is spread thin due to how many worlds she herself created and seemingly has no desire to absorb aether as Zodiark does. Even when she sends Minfilia to deal with the flood of light, it was not to absorb it but to halt its spread. If it had been say Ifrit, he would have gorged himself as all primals, excluding Hydaelyn, tend to do. I think she is straining to work under the conditions of her summoning. Save as many people as you can but never threaten their lives unless absolutely necessary (Minfilia) and only if it will save the majority. Hell, as it stands she is known to reside within the heart of the world and Sharlayan scholars built the Anti-Tower with the hope of communicating with her. She probably is responsible for the maintenance of the world in its fractured states and the flow of aether. Her power wains because there is only so much she can give before she herself is bled dry of aether, but she is still refusing to leech some for herself.

The real tragedy here is that the Ascians are partially correct, she is temporary and will one day be unable to sustain the balance. Zodiark could conceivably save everyone but would ultimately require so much aether as to kill everyone anyways as his desire for more aether would bleed everything dry. Two methods of retaining life and the status quo, but both end up killing everyone anyways. So the 14th makes the decision that everyone, even the lowest among us have a right to life and to strive for the future, and not just those deemed "worthy" by some arbitrary standard.

As Goes Light, So Goes Darkness

I see it as kind of like Mortal Kombat. In that series, Emperor Shao Khan lays claim to the Earthrealm, however, the Elder Gods intervene on the realms behalf. They devise a way for Earth to fight back against the Emperor as it would not be a fair fight due to one realm having much more power than the other, Mortal Kombat. It is a tournament that has few rules, namely that the Emperor and his minions must win 10 consecutive tournaments in order to lay claim to the earth, while Earth needs to only win once in order for the count to be reset. That series begins with the 10th tournament underway with 9 consecutive victories going to the Emperor. This is our last shot at beating the Ascians once and for all, if we fail at finding a way to stop them here, they will merge all of the shards and bring about the reunion. There is a reason that after we die in the current ("avoided") timeline, we do not reappear again and the world is left to eek out an existence with no hope. We are currently at 7 calamities, with all elements (Bahumat being a non elemental calamity) except light and darkness being used to cause them. Hydaelyn knows this, and decided to give us all of this power with the intent of ending the conflict before that happens. We are intentionally overpowered because it is the last time she can do this before her end.

We fall
We fall
We fall
We fall unto the end

One world's end

Our world's end

Our end

We won't end

I am shadow, I am the light

[Rannie]

Actually you have that backwards Riastrad. Unfortunately, due to her weakening during each Calamity the power she gives the WoL of that time is less and less.


Krile

On the cusp of an Umbral Calamity, souls blessed with the power of the Echo invariably appear.

To aid these Her chosen warriors, Hydaelyn bequeaths to each a sliver of Her strength in the form of a Crystal of Light.

But as Her strength wanes, so too does the potency of Her gifts. This crystal, born of an earlier era, is infused with a power far greater than those of this age.

*****


From The Eye of the Beholder quest where Krile first uses the Crystal Eye which is also a more powerful Crystal of Light given to a previous Calamities WoL.

Basically what I'm saying is the power she has given us isnt even enough to kill an Ascian. We have only killed 3 of them so far and as people have either pointed out on this thread or another one, it was outside forces that aided us in disposing of said Ascians. One was Tupismati combined with an aetheric converger and Moonbrydas own life force, the second was one of nidhoggs eyes and the third was killing off 4 light wardens and having Ardbert forge our soul back to health by rejoining with him.

[Riastrad]

Actually you have that backwards Riastrad. Unfortunately, due to her weakening during each Calamity the power she gives the WoL of that time is less and less.

each time our past selves failed and a calamity came and went, it stands to reason then as Zodiark grows stronger so would Hydaelyn as more aether seeps into the Source. However, we see she is spread thin due to how many worlds she herself created and seemingly has no desire to absorb aether as Zodiark does. Even when she sends Minfilia to deal with the flood of light, it was not to absorb it but to halt its spread. If it had been say Ifrit, he would have gorged himself as all primals, excluding Hydaelyn, tend to do. I think she is straining to work under the conditions of her summoning.

I am aware.

It's like that episode of Rick and Morty. "Keep Summer safe". Working with the bounds laid to the AI by Summer herself (don't kill people, don't recreate a deceased kid to horrify his father), the intelligence struggles to maintain its function within the limiting boundaries of it's creator/user. Oh sure it works, but it will not work forever. I was trying to say that from a story telling narrative, Hydaelyn is a primal and primals need aether. But, she seems to be going out of her way to not take any for herself, that is why she is weak after being able to sunder Zodiark. She should be a match for him as she defeated him when all reflections were whole. She is a dying battery that can be recharged but refuses do so.

Seeing as how the gift is diminishing as people are granted it, but we seem to be growing stronger (a fact the Ascians acknowledge repeatably), it stands to reason that this is our finale chance to end the conflict. She shot her last (and strongest) bullet. She's out of ammo and the enemy is closing in. So if we are going to be waited out (which I doubt) it would be a smart play by the Ascians. That is not how Elidibus plans on dealing with us however. He is summoning other Warriors of Light to deal with the Scions on the First.

[Rannie]

But your also saying we are over powered by her which we are not. She didnt give us "all this power". The power has been from OTHER sources. If she were to haven given us so much power, she would have directed us to try to find previous Crystal's of light which hold more of her power than what she has given us.

We are currently at 7 calamities, with all elements (Bahumat being a non elemental calamity) except light and darkness being used to cause them. Hydaelyn knows this, and decided to give us all of this power with the intent of ending the conflict before that happens. We are intentionally overpowered because it is the last time she can do this before her end.

[Riastrad]

Of all her chosen, blessed with the echo, who has been repeatably told by the Ascians that the gift they have is too powerful? The WoL, Ysayle, Minfilia, Krile, Arenvald? The answer is clear. We are not like the others, We not only have the Echo, but the Blessing of Light. The only other one to possess this power was Minfilia and later Ryne. Minfilia was no fighter and Ryne is only now becoming competent in her skills. The blessing is her way of trying to stack the odds in our favor. It gives us the power of "Breaking limits as only a true Warrior of Light could" when doing content. We level up, we can learn and master multiple jobs and keep growing stronger. Could Ysayle? Arenvald?

As for previous crystals of light, I would hazard a guess and say that many were spent when a previous version of the WoL was killed. Swallowed up by the darkness or even transferred to the life stream and as such no longer exist.

[Rannie]

The same blessing of light which protects Krile (which protected her from the Isle being Destroyed), arenvald is protected by the blessing as well since he can fight primals and Ysayle could have too. You're also forgetting that they may not be the same as our PC is, who happens to originally be an Ancient and has been shown in different quests that our aetheric capability is not the same as a normal mortal (which was answered by us being a now 8 time rejoined Ancient) so no that power still did not come from Hydaelyn.

Which while we have no proof that Echo users are not once ancient beings, we also have no proof at the time to show that they are.

We dont know what happened with the previous Crystal's of light though I do know for a fact that one is in Matoya's hands soooo the others could be floating out there somewhere as well. Btw that Crystal Eye's power wasnt spent it's still more powerful than our own crystals.

[Riastrad]

Krile was protected by Hydaelyn herself yes, but she does not have the blessing, the same way Hydaelyn directly interfered with the incident in Ul'dah by directing Minfilia into the spell Flow that Y'shtola casted. She only has the echo. Same with Arenvald and Ysayle.

The Blessing is not the Echo, but a separate power only given to her Champion and Oracle. No one else has its power. Even then, I am not aware of Minfilia or Ryne possessing crystals of light. We see them often in ARR and again when Midgardsormr stripped us of the Blessing. We still had the Echo, but not the protection afforded to us by Hydaelyn. He then gave us his blessing to buy her more time and to relieve the strain it placed on her.


Completely off conversation, can I say I am enjoying this back and forth?

[Rannie]

Uhm he never gave us his blessing.... he stated that he would neither help us nor harm us and he sealed her blessing so we could prove our own merit to him. Which we did when we slowly broke the seals. And krile her self in the exact same quest The Eye of the Beholder say that she too has the blessing of light..


Krile

Regrettably, our order's headquarters─and the isle itself─were obliterated by a magick of immense power. I have the blessing of Light to thank for my own preservation.

******

So yes they all have the blessing of light as per Ysayle have their own Crystal of Light.

(I'm needing to go to bed soon but =P)

[Riastrad]

Yet he mentions a Covenant being formed between you and him and Hydaelyn. It bound him to us for a reason, so he could watch and see if our struggles were with merit. Midgardsormr did all of this by shielding us from everything including Hydaelyn so that our connection with her would be even stronger. When we rekindle the blessing through our own power it was then that Hydaelyn gave us a warning that the Ascians are always close and to be wary.

You are correct about Krile though, I will admit that much (though I still wonder if that was not a figure of speech). But it still shows how both the echo and the blessing are separate things. I doubt that Arenvald has it, and to my knowledge, Ysayle never provided evidence to having the blessing either. Everyone with the echo can forge a crystal, but the blessing? No. We have all six elements while the others barely manage to make one. Matoya does mention that it would be nigh impossible to find another like the one she has. Lending to my theory that the majority have been destroyed or possibly reabsorbed as aether by the life stream.

If you complete all the role quests a special quest line is triggered. In it you find out Ardbert was the last WoL to create a crystal. They can only be forged through sacrifice and marks you as one of the chosen. Having more than one is an extremely rare thing. Having a complete set is nigh impossible. Further proof we are not like the others. Not by a long shot.


Rest well buddy.