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  1. #91
    Player
    Acidblood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    359
    Character
    Sylvaria Molkot
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur View Post
    The one reason I see not to do that is at Overpower/Mythril Tempest would become the fastest way to get the Storm's Eye buff. It would go from the AoE opener having a annoying single target start up to the single target opener having a AoE start up.
    At only 15s, and less potency than Heavy Swing > Maim, would that really be worth it? And if it is an issue then have Mythril Tempest give only 10s to start with, so not enough time to fit Infuriate x 2 + Inner Release, but with a cap of 15-20s so you can still maintain 100% uptime during AoE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Satarn View Post
    So? Seriously, why do people sometimes act as if double weaving on DRK was such a horrible thing? Lots of weaving contributed to the fast-paced, high APM feel which drawn a lot of people to DRK in the first place.

    Yeah, it can cause issues with high ping, but it's the same with other melee jobs which also had to double weave with 100% uptime speed buffs, heck the current DRK also has to double weave like mad during burst to get the most of it's damage.
    There is a difference between double weave for optimisation, which is optional and can be worked around, and double weave or the next tank buster will kill you / your ability won't work the way you wanted it to (see: NIN)... and not everyone lives next to the data centre.
    (2)

  2. #92
    Player
    Satarn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    522
    Character
    K'rheya Tia
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Acidblood View Post
    There is a difference between double weave for optimisation, which is optional and can be worked around, and double weave or the next tank buster will kill you / your ability won't work the way you wanted it to (see: NIN)... and not everyone lives next to the data centre.
    But the only detriment of double weaving on high ping is that you might clip a little, resulting in eventual loss of gcds over the course of the fight and thus lower dps. Either way it's the issue of optimization, not actual functionality.
    Ninjutsu is a completely separate problem due to how mudras interact with the server, so please don't drag it into this.
    (1)

  3. #93
    Player
    HollyWhyte's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Posts
    4
    Character
    Grouphug Happyheals
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 80
    You have this homogenization now because people complain constantly about x having 5% more DPS or y having more utility. They finally got fed up with it and just said okay you can all be roughly the same now instead of being unique with unique mechanics. Gone are the days where warriors had huge HP bars and felt more like raging meat walls compared to paladins that took less damage and wore plate/shields.

    Healing took very much the same route. At least the DPS classes all feel unique and fun, but I'm rather displeased with the route they've taken tanking and healing this expansion. Far far too much generalization. I guess it makes it easier to balance, but this is what we end up with when every tank or healer wants the other class's toys or to deal the exact same DPS as them.
    (1)

  4. #94
    Player
    Satarn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Posts
    522
    Character
    K'rheya Tia
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by HollyWhyte View Post
    You have this homogenization now because people complain constantly about x having 5% more DPS or y having more utility. They finally got fed up with it and just said okay you can all be roughly the same now instead of being unique with unique mechanics.
    This argument doesn't work when it comes to the dps rotations, which is what most tank players have the beef with. You can have several jobs with very similar dps output and completely different playstyles by just tweaking their numbers. Arriving to the same "destination" isn't a problem, having the same "journey" is.

    Even with utility you can make things slightly different but roughly equal, like how Dark Missionary and Shake it Off work now for example. Missionary being a 15 second mitigation buff can be used to reduce damage from multiple hits or even two close casts, but it suffers from diminishing returns when stacked with other similar buffs/debuffs. Shake on the other hand doesn't suffer from diminishing returns, but usually considerably mitigates the first hit it's up for and gets consumed right away. They're both very useful for dealing with raidwide damage, but their unique characteristics make them better in specific situations.

    I do agree however that player feedback is partly to blame, because people often fail to see those various advantages and weakness or look at the kit as a whole(like people complaining about how unfair it was that PLD had such long cds in SB, while completely ignoring the constant passive block which perfectly covered their fluff mitigation needs, not to mention the off-tank support skills). Even bigger issue I think, is people feeling the need to be "rewarded" extra for playing more complex jobs with more dps, while Yoshi has stated several times that they don't want to base balance around difficulty, so obviously anytime they hear the "it doesn't do enough damage for the effort" line, they're just gonna dumb down your job rather than buffing it like you wanted. If you enjoy playing more complex job then that should be reward enough(as long as the job isn't also obviously underpowered rater than equal, but that's another issue).

    I do think though that the job design team should "know better" than to listen to some feedback that would lead to bad, stale design, because there's always gonna be bad feedback. They should also stop trying to please everyone with every job rather than catering different jobs for different player groups, as that leads to actually pleasing less people overall.
    (1)

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