[Spoilers] Why Zenos is the most important character moving forward

[TankHunter678]

Yeah, I found Stormblood's main story somewhat deflating because Zenos did everything he could to be overthrown from Doma and Ala Mhigo. It makes me question what the true conflict was about.

Zenos stirred up revolutionary elements in Doma and Ala Mhigo intentionally for the purposes of his Hunt. He wanted an opponent to give him a challenge, and such an opponent grows out of adversity with a purpose. Granted Yotsuyu did a far better job at actually breaking the will of the Domans into submission, while Fordola did a great job at stirring up anger and rage in the Ala Mhigans. Zenos does not care about rulership, nor does he care about expanding the empire. If he lost control of the nations then oh well, it just means his Prey for his Hunt was coming for him. Ultimately us diving into the conflicts in both zones lead to us becoming Prey worthy of fighting him and his defeat at our hands turned us from worthy Prey to worthy Rival.

Which ultimately satisfied him, which is why he tried to end his life. Despite him musing over the offer of joining you to go hunt Primals and Ascians if you accepted him as a friend. That was his story. It ultimately still is his story since he did not properly die. In all likelihood he will find some way to turn the turmoil he will create out of apathy for ruling into a means for training the WoL to be even stronger so that they can have the next Ultimate Battle of Ultimate Destiny be even grander then the last.

[Edax]

Zenos stirred up revolutionary elements in Doma and Ala Mhigo intentionally for the purposes of his Hunt. He wanted an opponent to give him a challenge, and such an opponent grows out of adversity with a purpose. Granted Yotsuyu did a far better job at actually breaking the will of the Domans into submission, while Fordola did a great job at stirring up anger and rage in the Ala Mhigans. Zenos does not care about rulership, nor does he care about expanding the empire. If he lost control of the nations then oh well, it just means his Prey for his Hunt was coming for him. Ultimately us diving into the conflicts in both zones lead to us becoming Prey worthy of fighting him and his defeat at our hands turned us from worthy Prey to worthy Rival.

Which ultimately satisfied him, which is why he tried to end his life. Despite him musing over the offer of joining you to go hunt Primals and Ascians if you accepted him as a friend. That was his story. It ultimately still is his story since he did not properly die. In all likelihood he will find some way to turn the turmoil he will create out of apathy for ruling into a means for training the WoL to be even stronger so that they can have the next Ultimate Battle of Ultimate Destiny be even grander then the last.

I understand why he did it, it was just awkward that the protagonist and antagonist were pretty much working towards the same goal: rebellion. Maybe that's why I didn't feel all that triumphant when the credits rolled, it's kind of hard to put into words why I found Stormblood so unsatisfying...

[RopeDrink]

He wouldn't have even become the monster he is now if not for his legion's research teams, and I think he'd need similar minds on his side to fill his ambition of using Zodiark/Hydaelyn for his own gain. Assuming he doesn't end up universally shunned by the Garleans for his seeming assassination of the emperor, he's influential enough that I could see him rallying together followers under the false pretense of freeing the world from Hydaelyn/Zodiark's tyranny.

Seriously? Ala Mhigo, and Doma, and Garlemald be damned!

He was an absolute monster BEFORE acquiring his DIY-echo, as evidenced by the in-game scenes and external media apparently. This is NOT a case of introducing a Joe Soap who later becomes a Big Boss Soap thanks to phoning a friend. Saying he got there due to X or Y is far from accurate, and said research was done entirely in secret from most of the Empire via a shamed Aulus Mal Asina who just wanted the freedom to research cool stuff on the side. It is only after they tested it on Fordola first that he became one himself last I remember, meaning he didn't even have it until four WoL's fight him in the final Dungeon of SB.

Zenos is one of the primary reasons the war spiralled into the Empire's favour almost overnight. Even if you regard it "MSQ storytelling", he casually bested us twice in a row without the Resonant and was bored to tears doing it. It's not like the WoL was otherwise engaged during those times - the Mhigan's and Empire forces were, but those fights were as fair as could be given the circumstances. If any of his troops interfered in his little duel he'd have shoved a katana down their throat. A brief battle later and we're eating dirt. I embrace these moments as a refreshing reminder that we ourselves aren't unstoppable gods, yet it happened twice. Having said that, I hate resorting to duty/dungeon moments to explain things, but even if you remove that aspect, his power was documented as nothing short of obscenely strong even for a Garlean. As a man who casually made an Ascian piddle his robe from white to yellow just by walking into the room and threatening him, he now has a fully functional DIY echo capable of control and resurrecting himself just like the Ascians can.

Don't build Zenos up like it was more to do with his help or situation. The entire SB expansion goes contrary to this given he barely cared for anything on his own side, which was used primarily to set up his combat-contests and nothing more, serving the Empire whenever it suited himself. He's the one who couldn't give two bungholes about that Empire and would have dropped them like a hot spud if it got him what he wanted, as evidenced by both previous finales. Despite that, a hefty chunk of their success was all down to him being bored, and he repaid them by hacking his own people to pieces on numerous occasions just to make a point, one being the Emporer.

[ObsidianFire]

I found SB to not have a satisfying ending because Zenos let the Alliance win just so that he could fight us. I really got the feeling that had... nearly anyone else been in charge of the XIIth Legion that it would have taken the Alliance and Doma way longer to free their nations (if they ever managed to do so) and at the cost of much more lives.

Zenos basically lets us ambush him in Doma just to test if he was right about us providing him with decent sport. And then he all but lets the Alliance waltz into Ala Mhigo so that we can have our final showdown. It certainly made the Ala Mhigan victory feel very hollow when all Zenos had to do was go out and fight the Alliance like he had done at Rhalgr's Reach and the entire thing would have taken way longer at the cost of more lives.

[TankHunter678]

I understand why he did it, it was just awkward that the protagonist and antagonist were pretty much working towards the same goal: rebellion. Maybe that's why I didn't feel all that triumphant when the credits rolled, it's kind of hard to put into words why I found Stormblood so unsatisfying...

It is the same kinda logic behind a person hailed as a Hero working in secret to raise the ultimate villain who could truly defeat them or at least give people reason to praise the Hero again if they could not defeat the Hero. That was the basic plot of Disgaea 3 Absence of Justice. Where the main villain was a Hero who was tired of constantly being revived by various gods to just solve every single villain problem, so he sought to die at the hands of the Ultimate Villain. However he defeated said Ultimate Villain because they held back, as their son was in the area and would have been destroyed by the same ultimate attack that would have destroyed the Hero completely soul and all. So the Hero took to raising the Ultimate Villain's son (the main character) to replace him, then bait him into attacking the human world where the Hero would then intercept him. With the ultimate Goal being either the Hero dies and all of humanity dies with him so that there is no one to plead with the gods to revive him, or he wins and he obtains a few hundred years more of praise while he restarts the process. Plan goes awry thanks to the MC's friend who becomes a Hero as a result who got the MC to not go on a rampage in the Human world, the Hero-turned-Villain gets defeated but is not allowed true death and is enslaved for the rest of existence as a Butler and research specimen.

[LineageRazor]

As for Zenos, I think we've only seen things from his angle so far, and I believe there's a little misdirection to give the impression he may be powerful enough to succeed at his goal. I don't think he is. He was able to quell a Primal summoned out of rage at a fraction of the strength of a Primal like Hydaelyn or Zodiark. Although I think he'll be a useful tool in hastening the Rejoining, I believe he will be squashed by Zodiark and absorbed into him as a "reward" for his hubris, taking his body in the process. What he is capable of doing is being a very resilient pest and thorn in your side.

Oh, if Zenos actually manages to get that far, I think it's fairly likely that he will successfully control Zodiark. It's not a matter of power, it's a matter of will - and Zodiark, for all his power, has no real will of his own. No Primal does; they are all bound to follow the wills of their creators. Zenos worked this out on his own, and used that knowledge to subvert Shinryu to his will. If he gets the chance to do the same to Zodiark, I expect much the same. The scenario we're in isn't remotely like the classic yarn of the ambitious fool who meddles with beings beyond his comprehension. Zenos is a sociopath and a narcissist, but he's not a fool.

[ObsidianFire]

It's not a matter of power, it's a matter of will - and Zodiark, for all his power, has no real will of his own. No Primal does; they are all bound to follow the wills of their creators.

Primals definetly have wills of their own. It might be based on the concept their summoner had in mind when they were summoning, but they are fully sapient beings in their own right. This is the entire point of realizing that primal summoning is Creation Magic. When a primal is summoned, you have someone making a new being. The Anima quest is a good quest to read through since in that one it is the WoL who is making a being from aether. And that being directly compares itself to the primals.

That Zoidark can Temper the Convocation of Thirteen, who are the most powerful Ancients of their day, says something about how great his influence is and how much aether and control he has. His title is "Keeper of Precepts" and he is capable of rewriting the laws of existence. If you want to get really technical... Tempering is rewriting the aether of a person's mind so they are obsessed with the primal.

I think what Zenos did probably wasn't tempering either. We see the Ascians posses living beings all the time. What's to stop them from possessing a primal? That said... Zenos has the aether of countless Ancient souls in him. At the very least, he's probably got way more aether then any being we have ever come across and was designed to change the world as his creators desired. Letting Zoidark be controlled by something is not something I see the Convocation of Thirteen wanting to happen to Zodiark when they created him.

[KageTokage]

snip

I'm not saying he's only a threat because of the artificial Echo, but he wouldn't be the immortal menace he is now without it.

For that matter, I feel like the most poetic way for him to go out would be for Zodiark to overwhelm him when he tries to do whatever it is he's scheming. I don't think I'd really agree with things going exactly his way yet again and just having a repeat of what happened with Shinryu.