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  1. #1
    Player
    coppersloane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    7
    Character
    Maddox Stroud
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 78
    These modern MMORPG developers really don't seem to understand one simple thing: People play MMORPGs (and even the MMO-lite stuff with action elements) because they enjoy micromanagement. If you're pruning in an MMO, you're doing things wrong. If a skill has become useless, rework it into something else, but do not remove it.

    We want a crapload of skills. We want to open up a spellbook and ruminate over the wide range of spells. We want to make decisions. What we do not want is to be told, through pruning, what to do. Start telling us what to do through linearity and we'll be unhappy and we will stop playing your game.
    (22)

  2. #2
    Player
    nalol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Posts
    63
    Character
    Nalol Inta
    World
    Louisoix
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by coppersloane View Post
    These modern MMORPG developers really don't seem to understand one simple thing: People play MMORPGs (and even the MMO-lite stuff with action elements) because they enjoy micromanagement. If you're pruning in an MMO, you're doing things wrong. If a skill has become useless, rework it into something else, but do not remove it.

    We want a crapload of skills. We want to open up a spellbook and ruminate over the wide range of spells. We want to make decisions. What we do not want is to be told, through pruning, what to do. Start telling us what to do through linearity and we'll be unhappy and we will stop playing your game.
    but controllers are more limited then. u cannot add too many skills I guess

    and at some point too many isn't good either. I come from EQ2 ..where they added and added ... but u just don't have enough hotbars anymore and few spells/abilities become useless. you realize that you don't need that much abilities .. also too many abilities can start to make some classes step on others and so on.

    the issue I see in FF14 is when u do low level dongeons, u feel the lack of skills while at higher level u usually feel quite busy. so it makes low levels really boring.


    to me .. u need enough skills to feel busy and some complexity in the class with enough decision making
    (1)

  3. #3
    Player
    Rufalus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    2,730
    Character
    Lufie Newleaf
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by coppersloane View Post
    These modern MMORPG developers really don't seem to understand one simple thing: People play MMORPGs (and even the MMO-lite stuff with action elements) because they enjoy micromanagement. If you're pruning in an MMO, you're doing things wrong. If a skill has become useless, rework it into something else, but do not remove it.

    We want a crapload of skills. We want to open up a spellbook and ruminate over the wide range of spells. We want to make decisions. What we do not want is to be told, through pruning, what to do. Start telling us what to do through linearity and we'll be unhappy and we will stop playing your game.
    This is absolutely true for some people but not a rule for everybody. MMOs have evolved and the types of people who play them broadened. S-E said people were begging them for fewer buttons so much that there's even some people who redo their hotbar each time they enter content at a different sync level. For some reason they don't want to use additional hotbars and can't fit all of their buttons in at once; they only bring the buttons they think are most relevant to the duty they are doing. They are for sure getting pressure from part of the community to consolidate stuff, not doing it out of ignorance or malice.

    I will say though I think it's not the amount of buttons but what you do with them. MMOs can still be engaging with fewer buttons by shifting the complexity into other parts of the design and having the hotbar be more contextual, adapting it to offer only the relevant options you need in that moment. It's less intuitive to navigate a bigass spell list during what is pretty much action combat these days. When combat was more slow and thoughtful, tactical, it made sense. I like tactical games too but it's not this game. However healer dps specifically has always been boring in this game imo. That has been consolidated too much, even back at the beginning.
    (3)

  4. #4
    Player
    YanderePrincess's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    368
    Character
    Svana Fyth
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by coppersloane View Post
    These modern MMORPG developers really don't seem to understand one simple thing: People play MMORPGs (and even the MMO-lite stuff with action elements) because they enjoy micromanagement. If you're pruning in an MMO, you're doing things wrong. If a skill has become useless, rework it into something else, but do not remove it.

    We want a crapload of skills. We want to open up a spellbook and ruminate over the wide range of spells. We want to make decisions. What we do not want is to be told, through pruning, what to do. Start telling us what to do through linearity and we'll be unhappy and we will stop playing your game.
    Um, no? There is literally no point in having more skills than I can access or actually use. DDO had that because of it was based on v3.5 D&D. We didn't "make decisions." We took the exact same list of spells 99% of the time because they were the most effective spells. Blue Mage in FFXI is probably the best example of this concept being done right, but even they had specific layouts they'd take depending on the content they were doing and the role they were playing for that content. The only "choice" involved was possibly in which role you'd fill, but that was less often your choice than your group's choice. Choices like this get subsumed by cookie cutter builds, because in an MMO what's most effective will reign.

    I feel like you don't properly understand what micromanagement is, either.
    (0)
    "Women are meant to be loved, not to be understood." ~Oscar Wilde