Patch 5.05 DPS balance discussion Nin+Dnc

[Marianno]

I think that if we want to close the gap then the devs need to think about how to fix the SMN rotation with QOL changes and not necessarily buffs. SMN was a bit out of control with what the devs did in 4.1. I also think that if we look at how strong the synergy is with respect to melee and casters, we will find that casters are more or less forced to stand on their own or assist melee. For example, RDM works well with melee setups, seems (IMO) most ranges physical setups works well with melee setups. SMN works well with all jobs due to devotion but we have to admit, people often design team strays around melee uptime. This discussion lends credence to more deeper issues at the heart of the problem. Why does melee have such great synergy and casters do not? Why are casters forced to stand on their own and melee are not? Why are stats always designed around melee uptime and even knowing BLM has tons of damage, people still choose melee over it and design strategies around melee?! If SE fixed synergy between the casters, we may get changes we want to see. Since casters have no synergy and melee has synergy, this disparity will continue. Buffing SMN is not the way to fix this problem. Fixing its clunky rotation and shorten that run cast is a start but more needs to be done.

[DaulBan]

Why does melee have such great synergy and casters do not? Why are casters forced to stand on their own and melee are not? Why are stats always designed around melee uptime and even knowing BLM has tons of damage, people still choose melee over it and design strategies around melee?! If SE fixed synergy between the casters, we may get changes we want to see. Since casters have no synergy and melee has synergy, this disparity will continue. Buffing SMN is not the way to fix this problem.

Truth be told the only thing that approximates 'melee' synergy is dragoon tether. Physical buffs certainly exist but they also effect ranged phys, so it's not like it's a melee-only thing. Dragoon historically specifically buffed ranged phys as well. Slashing is the only real example I can think of, with HW slashing buffing four melee off of one job's rotation.

RE: BLM vs Melee, this hasn't really been tested yet. HW the meta was double ranged phys where movement was much less of an issue than BLM, and in StB SMN was meta and again suffered fairly little from movement due to a low potency difference beetween Ruin 3 and 2. Currently, it looks like BLM is going to be meta, and it is likely that groups will try to make sure BLM have reasonable uptime. Speaking from personal experience (which is only up to E3S) there's only one case where I could see the plebs doing something stupid for a strat with BLM and that's having it kite puddles in the E1S transition instead of having the melee do a dance. And for the BLM mains shooting for the proverbial stars I'm sure they'll find better and better methods of handling mechanics that might otherwise interrupt them. That goes the same for other casters that choose to keep on with what they're playing.

In the end, the disparity between casters (non-BLM) and melee (non-NIN) is strictly that they just do more damage and have actual utility for the group period. RDM has something, which helps, but its personal dps is so bad it doesn't make a difference. There's no reason to use it in your wildcard slot after prog.