Reminder that war is still good.

[Chrono_Rising]

Snip

I'm not saying I agree. But, I can also see where people are coming from on this. Yes, historically warrior has always had a 3 combo wind up to aoe. But, historically warrior also had the best aoe of the tanks, and the trade off we thought was the wind up. But I am not sure this is the case anymore. I think that is the clunk that people are grappling with currently. Is the wind up worth it to be 3rd best in aoe?

[Kabooa]

I'm not saying I agree. But, I can also see where people are coming from on this. Yes, historically warrior has always had a 3 combo wind up to aoe. But, historically warrior also had the best aoe of the tanks, and the trade off we thought was the wind up. But I am not sure this is the case anymore. I think that is the clunk that people are grappling with currently. Is the wind up worth it to be 3rd best in aoe?

I'm like half certain IR Decimate, IF Chaos, and Nascent Flash still win out an easy first place.

[Chrono_Rising]

I'm like half certain IR Decimate, IF Chaos, and Nascent Flash still win out an easy first place.

Can you offer something to support your half certain? Also Nascent Flash isn't damage its HP restore so not sure how that is a factor here. I agree warrior has some powerful aoe options. For example IR spam is about 2342 factoring in direct hit and crit. Paladin magic spam over the same number of GCDs is 2700 potency before crits and direct hits and its up more often. Then you need to compare that with boosted physical combo also up every minute as well as circle of scorn. Paladin has some nice aoe.

[Chrono_Rising]

No edit option on phone. Potencies reported are per target. The only reason I can guess Nascent Flash is mentioned is to try to bring in a variable about healer dps I would imagine.

[Kabooa]

Can you offer something to support your half certain? Also Nascent Flash isn't damage its HP restore so not sure how that is a factor here. I agree warrior has some powerful aoe options. For example IR spam is about 2342 factoring in direct hit and crit. Paladin magic spam over the same number of GCDs is 2700 potency before crits and direct hits and its up more often. Then you need to compare that with boosted physical combo also up every minute as well as circle of scorn. Paladin has some nice aoe.

I'm honestly too tired to do math.

That said, I did forget that Paladin has absurd AoE now, but the two should be pretty even in practical scenarios.

[Argyle_Darkheart]

Honestly, I think the "issue" is that Storm's Eye doesn't feel very rewarding.

[Kabooa]

Honestly, I think the "issue" is that Storm's Eye doesn't feel very rewarding.

To be quite honest, I would love having combo finishers that had cooldowns on them.

3 or 4 combo finishers, the '3' in a 1 2 3 line, and have them have something like 7.5 second cooldowns, and then give them more impactful effects.

[Izsha]

I'm not saying I agree. But, I can also see where people are coming from on this. Yes, historically warrior has always had a 3 combo wind up to aoe. But, historically warrior also had the best aoe of the tanks, and the trade off we thought was the wind up. But I am not sure this is the case anymore. I think that is the clunk that people are grappling with currently. Is the wind up worth it to be 3rd best in aoe?

2 points.

1. Not all the rise of eye complaints are about aoe. Some cite single target ramp up as unfair because other tanks have no ramp. "4 gcds if you count tomahawk" in the post i responded to for example. So the loss of aoe damage trade off is wholely irrelivant here. This ramp up in single target has ALWAYS been there between eye and slashing you always had to setup 3 gcds to be at full power at all points in 14s history and other tanks had functionally zero.

2. If eye is 'clunky' (in aoe) because war was designed to have stronger aoe and eye was compensation, and war no longer has the aoe damage to justify eye then there is a simple solution to that. Increase wars aoe damage to restore that tradeoff. The alternative is the always hated homogenization. "I dont have what other tanks have so gimme" just means all tanks end up with 1 combo and insta damage buffs. If aoe damage is to lacking to justify the expense of putting eye up, then dont remove eye. Return war to the state that no one thought eye was a problem instead.

Persoanlly i dont think it is an issue because you can put up eye 2-3x per dungeon with the extensions built in, and in raid scenarios you never just go cold turkey into an aoe phase and should already have eye anyway. But if the masses really feel war aoe is a problem then by all means adjust it. Dont trim down the simplest job with the fewest actions to arr 123+flash paladin. Just because other tanks dont have a ramp up doesnt mean the solution is to make war even more like every other tank when there are still active threads complaining about drk having 1 combo and simplifying their aoe rotation. 1 combo wonders for even more tanks, ill pass. If this really must be considered a problem at all, there are far more elegant solutions.

[Chrono_Rising]

Snip

Again, not saying I agree with them that this is clunky. in ST this breaks up the 123 spam which dark knight currently deals with. I don't think its really an issue to apply this before starting aoe or st.

[BarretOblivion]

Xeno had 2 major complains about WAR.

1 - need 3 GCDs for 10% buff at pull (4 if you count the tomahawk).
2 - need a minor potency increase on some weaponskills.


That is all the changes warrior needs, no onslaught dumb changes please.

You sure about that? I distincly remember him saying onslaught needed a change since it was in a weird spot.