So are we going to have to wait until after Savage releases to expect changes?

[EpicOverlord85]

*Main DRK here*
*Looks over healers complaints*

Oh, they think it will come before 6.0... *Laughts in Stormblood DRK*

As a DRK/SCH main....damn man you nailed that one on the head.

[Trunks]

I'm surprised that the very obvious changes to healing calculations appear absent from this conversation. They reiterated numerous times prior to release that potencies and tooltips didn't mean anything because of this. Like many people, I assumed the changes were mostly going to damage formulae. Now I suspect that they left that intentionally vague because they didn't want to stir a rebellion by announcing a blanket nerf to healing.

Yet that's exactly what we got. From level 70 (ilvl 400) to level 80 (ilvl 430) my HP increased by about 50%, while the raw healing numbers on my spells increased by about 5%. This is not just "substat crunch". They changed the scaling on our spells.

It's become difficult to argue about what future encounters will and will not demand of our toolkits based on past encounters, because we're in uncharted territory. Healing values have always scaled almost 1:1 with hitpoint values. That's no longer the case.

We can draw comparisons on the relative strength of the Jobs - AST is definitely looking weak - but saying "healing that demanding doesn't exist!" may no longer be a true statement. The meta has fundamentally shifted in ways we cannot yet fully asses based on past or present data or experience. This does not negate the gameplay complaints that Scholars have, of course (they happen to have as many GCD heal spells as they do GCD damage spells - 3). I just think it's a bit premature to be making generalizations about what the healing role will and will not demand in upcoming content.

[CaesarCV]

To all of those who say that healing requirements have changed significantly, I find that argument quite silly. Some of them are probably just mixed up since they don't remember undergeared leveling dungeons. Those are harder and require more healing. But even in a situation that should theoretically require a TON of healing (Expert Roulette Undergeared Wall to Wall Pulling) I can still afford to easily spend a ton of time on DPS. Between Recitation, Excogitation. Seraph, Fey Union, Whispering Dawn and other skills I can easily DPS for much of a pull.

Healers are SUPER STRONG AT HEALING right now. Even EX Trials are starting to move to a Solo Heal meta.

The issue isn't that we're weak. It's that our classes are boring.

To be fair, the one blessing we do have for SCH is that some of the problems are realistically fixable in a patch. SCH would be in a much better place (at least personally) if they:

1. Allowed Aetherflow out of combat. I get that they want to help those poor DPS and tanks who don't want to risk waiting, but the bigger ones who wanted the wait were SMN anyway, and they're mostly fine with the change.

2. Gave us a way to deal damage with Aetherflow Stacks. As it stands, there is basically no reason to engage with one of our core mechanics (aetherflow) outside of group content. This makes solo duties and overworld content exceptionally boring, especially when they seemed to make an effort to give DPS and Tank classes ways to engage with their core mechanic in most scenarios. It would also help with us having too much Aetherflow stacks to go around, and create additional tactical considerations as the player has to gauge whether or not they can afford to burn stacks on damage.

3. A few buffs and nerfs to try and fix abilities. Fey Blessing should probably be way stronger for example, and there are still weird dumb interactions like Fey Illumination not aiding our most important healing abilities and dissipation having the same problem.

[Crushnight]

Historically there has always been a massive balance patch when either normal mode or savage gets released so in 5 days or a little under 3 weeks. I'm optimistic about it, things have been like this before. In heavensward class previews, there was outrage from brd/mch mains who saw the changes to their class. Nothing was changed when early access hit, but when SE realized that everyone was right, they got some big changes 2 weeks after release. The same thing happened with stormblood sch and war except they were fixed 4 weeks in on savage release. While the developers have made pretty questionable design choices many times, they've usually been pretty good about listening to player feedback. Thank heavens this isn't blizzard we're dealing with.

Hw ast had to wait until 2 weeks after savage for healing potencies to be buffed to acceptable levels, their healing, their primary role was unacceptable for content for 6 weeks(it was certainly doable but you were having to work a lot harder for it at the detriment to your party because sch/whm were just that much better, kinda like now :P), so this would probably be the earliest we see any sort of buffs in my eyes.

hopefully they surprise me but doubt it.

Major playstyle changes will likely come with the next expansion. Minor changes can come anytime.

At best we can hope for a new skill with an already existing animation or something.

2.0 war, and 4.0 war would like a word, it is completely within the devs control to do an overhaul they just have to want to, usually its war that gets it but its possible mid expansion any job could.

I don’t think SE needs statistics from Savage Content to make adjustments to AST right now.... SCH and WHM will have more light shed on them through out the raid tier, but AST is already at such a huge disadvantage, I wouldn’t be surprised if we saw a major overhaul, similar to WAR at the start of SB.

No they don't need savage, though they are probably waiting for it for 'numbers'.

Healing design team have never come close to any sort of balance and i honestly don't ever expect it at this point, which is a real shame because healing was fun but it is becoming less engaging as time goes on for the sake of this balance, they need someone who can be wholly committed to healers and only healers because right now they have repeatedly made it seem like healers are an afterthought.
/minirant over

[Toystore]

With a way a certain sector of the dps healer population operates, there's no need for feedback from them regardless.

You hear certain terms like 'moving the goalpost' that shows they have absolutely no intention of working within the new system. They had their minds made up from the beginning and no matter what content there is, the answer is 'nope healers suck change them back'. This is why your feedback is just straight noise. Come at it with genuine good faith and maybe it will bring something to the discussion.

I would expect someone with a Dragon Warrior 3 name to not be in that category of player. It's really a shame.

[Crushnight]

With a way a certain sector of the dps healer population operates, there's no need for feedback from them regardless.

You hear certain terms like 'moving the goalpost' that shows they have absolutely no intention of working within the new system. They had their minds made up from the beginning and no matter what content there is, the answer is 'nope healers suck change them back'. This is why your feedback is just straight noise. Come at it with genuine good faith and maybe it will bring something to the discussion.

I would expect someone with a Dragon Warrior 3 name to not be in that category of player. It's really a shame.

Dps when i can hlr here

Whm - in a good spot so long as it keeps it's current momentum of being a powerhouse not much needs to happen just potentially a dps lily expender so you are not waiting for people to take damage as damage is not always going out so solace/rapture is not always needed.

Sch- Energy drain, give this back which won't change anything about current sch except give the decision do i expend this aetherflow stack on dps or will i need it for healing. Nothing else changes and sch will remain where it is.

Ast - Buff healing, CU, CO and Divination, most people who are fine with the new system are asking for ast buffs that are for numbers being upped/cd reductions, yes there are people asking for an overhaul to get back SB ast because it was that much better than current ast but they would also admit ast was a bit too good at the same time.

People are focusing on dps because when it comes to higher end content people unfortunately judge how much you can bring to a party when you start to feel inadequate people will start to exclude you from groups and i'd rather not have a 3.0 ast repeat

[Kabooa]

Listen... if someone hates something it doesn't make their feedback less valuable. For the record, I categorically refuse to level any healer at all unless this mess is reverted. Backwards design decisions. People DPS as much as they ever did, just with less buttons to do it.

It'd also be odd for more people to love the changes than hate them, given the very obvious shortage of people playing the role since the expansion dropped.

Queue times seem the same for a DPS, so clearly not -that- much of a shortage.

[Reiryuu]

Queue times seem the same for a DPS, so clearly not -that- much of a shortage.

But there are times even when leveling a tank, you can get some pretty long queues as well . Heck, even when I see some of these DPS in need roulettes pop up, the queue seems to take a really long time. I just had one where the wait was still something like 20+ minutes and I was 50th in the role list despite DPS being "in need." I think something might be wonky with the "in need" bonus calculations... but I don't know what's going on with it nor will I pretend to.

[Awha]

I hope they do not give AST the DRK treatment and make them wait until 6.0

[kidalutz]

/laughs in White Mage

Are you sure about that?

Thread number... 57 about healers you're late to the bandwagon it's over that way.