[Spoilers] Noble Sacrifices (and the lack thereof)

[FrejyaAthenes]

Also the quest chain in HW were we retrace are steps has us go back to Azys La and pay our respects to her, as well as seeing that Estinien had also done so and even brought her flowers.

Thats not even getting into how Tales of the Storm revealed that he named his new Dragoon armor Iceheart in memory of her.

Basically Estiniien is the president of the Iceheart fan club and it was a ship to good for this cruel world.

What quest was that?

[SannaR]

The Tales series aren't quests but mini stories they put up during the early parts of an expansion that sometimes show things after the msq is over, before it, or happening along side it.

[Seraph522]

What quest was that?

The Tales series aren't quests but mini stories they put up during the early parts of an expansion that sometimes show things after the msq is over, before it, or happening along side it.

You can find them here, if you're interested. Tales from the Storm are Stormblood-era, but there are others from HW and ARR/Legacy as well; I wouldn't be surprised if we get some for Shadowbringers as well down the line.

[Bright-Flower]

Anything Thancred does is achieved through some manner of artifice or skill; in the case of his ability to evade Ran'jit, he was using an alchemical concoction that slowed his aetherial circulation to make him imperceptible to Ran'jit's senses. Since the latter appears to be half-Sin Eater like Vauthry, relying on aethersense makes perfect sense for him, as it allows him to see through illusions; by slowing his aetherial circulation Thancred is able to deceive that sixth sense of his, which Ran'jit heavily relies on. (The third time Thancred has to completely halt his aetherial circulation, which begins damaging his internal organs, to deceive Ran'jit's senses.)

And no, you don't need to be able to manipulate aether to perform superhuman feats in XIV's universe, it seems. Gaius is capable of killing Ascians without that same capability, if only their mortal guises.

True but Garlean bodies are said to be physically stronger than other spoken races, I guess that'st he tradeoff for not having aether use.

Did someone elaborate on what he was doing in some text I missed? Because that makes sense, during the quest I thought he was just literally going invisible which was also baffling me because that never seemed to work BEFORE on Ran'jit.

[Dualblade]

True but Garlean bodies are said to be physically stronger than other spoken races, I guess that'st he tradeoff for not having aether use.

Did someone elaborate on what he was doing in some text I missed? Because that makes sense, during the quest I thought he was just literally going invisible which was also baffling me because that never seemed to work BEFORE on Ran'jit.

I'm pretty sure the buff/debuff you get when you use the role action specifically calls it an alchemical concoction made by Urianger for Thancred's use. I also wonder if part of the reason it works is because Thancred isn't in his original body and we aren't really ever given an explanation for how the Scions current forms work in the First. They can take damage and die but they never possessed any bodies either.

[Hezzlocks]

I'm pretty sure the buff/debuff you get when you use the role action specifically calls it an alchemical concoction made by Urianger for Thancred's use. I also wonder if part of the reason it works is because Thancred isn't in his original body and we aren't really ever given an explanation for how the Scions current forms work in the First. They can take damage and die but they never possessed any bodies either.

Pure speculation of course but the answer to that question must be in how did Ardbert and co do it. One can't help but notice the similarities between the Scions condition and how the Warriors of Darkness appeared, physical in appearance, able to be hurt or killed, yet merely souls.

There's only two differences. First, the state of their bodies. The WoDs had to sacrifice their lives to travel to the source. They were very much so already dead when we met them, with no bodies to return to. The Scions are still alive, merely in a state similar to a coma. Alive and healthy, just no soul to pilot it.
Secondly, the method of travel. The WoDs were guided by Elidibus into using their crystals to travel across the void. The Scions were literally pulled across the void, their souls summoned by Crystal Exarch, even if only by accident.

Beyond those two things they are in very similar states of existence. We may need to study both the Scions and the WoDs to discern the truth

[TankHunter678]

I'm pretty sure the buff/debuff you get when you use the role action specifically calls it an alchemical concoction made by Urianger for Thancred's use. I also wonder if part of the reason it works is because Thancred isn't in his original body and we aren't really ever given an explanation for how the Scions current forms work in the First. They can take damage and die but they never possessed any bodies either.

The Crystal Exarch basically described them as solid spirits. They do not have proper bodies and do not properly exist as far as the world is concerned.

[Cilia]

The Crystal Exarch basically described them as solid spirits. They do not have proper bodies and do not properly exist as far as the world is concerned.

Yet they possess the same physical limitations they did on the Source... Thancred still can't manipulate aether, and Y'shtola is still (physically) blind.

I get the feeling they wanted the Scions on the First but didn't know how to write around the whole "can't traverse the Rift without dying" bit, so they just went with that. Rankles big time as far as I'm concerned.

[Hezzlocks]

Yet they possess the same physical limitations they did on the Source... Thancred still can't manipulate aether, and Y'shtola is still (physically) blind.

I get the feeling they wanted the Scions on the First but didn't know how to write around the whole "can't traverse the Rift without dying" bit, so they just went with that. Rankles big time as far as I'm concerned.

No, thats not it. If it were that they could have done it the same way as WoL, they just vanish, body and all, and get summoned to the First.

The real reason is age. While their souls have been on the First for several years, upwards of 5 years for Thancred, their physical bodies have only aged mere days. By doing it this way, the devs can have the Scions spend several years becoming settled in and acquainted with people / the land, while not having to worry about aging them. This is of particular note with the twins, as they are just a couple of years away from being full grown Elezen and should be growing quite rapidly. They in particular would look quite different even in the space of a year.

[Jandor]

Are we even sure the Scions can die in the first? They don't seem to age while they're there.

It's obviously not the sort of thing any of them are keen to try, but maybe their weird pseudo-ghost form dying in the first just sends the soul back where it belongs.