Am I doing SMN wrong or is there just a LOT to do?

[Alym]

Maybe some rehashes and possibly unbalanced, but here's a few things I would like to see:

- I think it's odd that they didn't marry Demi-Bahamut to DWT like they did for Demi-Phoenix with FBT. I think that would've flowed better and allowed for better weaving with Demi-Bahamut out, even though that doesn't help WW anymore. To me, this would've given us two burst phases without this weird flow of DWT into Demi-Bahamut into FBT/Demi-Phoenix. It would be less hectic in the middle, too.

- Energy Drain and Energy Siphon feel so pointless. Why not just let Aetherflow stacks build up over time to a max of 4? It would cut back on at least one ogcd.

- Outburst should have no cast time to allow for AoE weaving without clipping. You either clip or you use Ruin 2/4 and it feels bad either way.

- Increase DPS in general or make Devotion a lot stronger.

- I don't have a suggestion for this, but EA 1 and 2 feel bad to use and create so many ogcds that it can easily become overwhelming. I like the idea of being able to set them to be used automatically, but then the pets just become SB pets on Sic.

- Phoenix grants a boost of 1% (or whatever) damage for each party member instead of a Regen. Call it "Life Boost" or something friendly to Phoenix lore.

- Removing Bane from the aetherflow mechanic is awesome, but without any real limit beyond the 10 sec cd it's sort of pointless. Could be a trait instead called Contagion (HA!) that auto spreads dots to nearby targets every 10 seconds instead.

- Make physick useful to smn, or remove it and make it sch exclusive while giving us something else in its place.

Overall, I like smn, but it feels so much worse to play than the other casters. They're gracefully galloping around having a great time while I feel like a newborn giraffe playing smn.

[Rakith]

I like it a lot as well but adjustments should indeed be made. Energy drain is not a good idea indeed.
I wish we still had pet appearing in team players' list.
I would like SMN experts to tell me if all the things we do really pay off dps wise in the end.

[Yandere-chan]

I realize most people who like the changes aren't going to go on forums to praise it relative to those who will go on to complain, but I actually really like Summoner and how busy it feels. To me, difficulty justifies better damage, so keep it as is, and IF the damage output of Summoner fully optimized isn't what you all feel it should be, suggest buffs to output. I feel like the more they simplify things down, the less justified it is for Summoner to have really great dps relative to other high dps classes.

One change I would welcome though is for Egi Assault 1 & 2 to give Ruin IV immediately rather than on hit. It also would help titan's Egi Assault 1. Also, have pet actions que up. Like, if you spam Egi Assault 1 & 2 and Enkindle, instead of losing one or two of those skills from being done from the pet, have the pet have a que that will attempt to do all those skills til all of them have been done, that way nothing is ever wasted.

[NovaBismarck]

I can at least state the following. My husband and I play together on dps smn and rdm. Before the release our damage was comparable to each other. Able to execute various content in an identical timeframe. We both ran the solo Ranjit fight tonight. I was sitting several ilvls higher, popping raid food and still failed the first run through on damage. I was struggling to get the fight done in the required time frame. I ended up sitting on bahamut and phx a long time to wait on the final phase because the if I was stuck in 40 seconds of r3 I would have wiped. I'd practiced the rotation suggestions, I wasn't going in blind with no good ideas on how to run it. I understand there's still a lot to deal with the muscle memory changes and I had to do some rekey work, but overall I've practiced enough that I wasn't completely getting the rotation wrong. There's some failure on the part of having to learn so much in such, but should smn be harder than other classes to execute? I thought we were getting some simplification. Pet AI is janky and with the changes I'm feeling it more. As Nemekh says, we'll learn to adjust. While some parts of summoner feel good, there are parts that definitely feel like I've taken a step back instead of forward.

Yandere, I also don't like the way the assaults read sometimes. A little lag or other problems and your commands are screwed.

[Yandere-chan]

@Nova - Well, an improvement to how commands are handled by the pet would help in two fold (three if you count titan egi 1 triggering Ruin 4 which it really should) in that it would stop you from accidentally having your pet waste a skill as well as encourage you to spam pet skills, making it easier to get through all your ocds since you wouldn't have to space out your egi assault anymore like you do now. It would instantly fill your Ruin 4 stacks to max too, which that feels like how it should work really, so you have extra incentive to use your instant spell while you get your other ocds out of the way. Sometimes a small change can make a big difference.

[Mansion]

I can at least state the following. My husband and I play together on dps smn and rdm. Before the release our damage was comparable to each other. Able to execute various content in an identical timeframe. We both ran the solo Ranjit fight tonight. I was sitting several ilvls higher, popping raid food and still failed the first run through on damage. I was struggling to get the fight done in the required time frame. I ended up sitting on bahamut and phx a long time to wait on the final phase because the if I was stuck in 40 seconds of r3 I would have wiped. I'd practiced the rotation suggestions, I wasn't going in blind with no good ideas on how to run it. I understand there's still a lot to deal with the muscle memory changes and I had to do some rekey work, but overall I've practiced enough that I wasn't completely getting the rotation wrong. There's some failure on the part of having to learn so much in such, but should smn be harder than other classes to execute? I thought we were getting some simplification. Pet AI is janky and with the changes I'm feeling it more. As Nemekh says, we'll learn to adjust. While some parts of summoner feel good, there are parts that definitely feel like I've taken a step back instead of forward.

Yandere, I also don't like the way the assaults read sometimes. A little lag or other problems and your commands are screwed.

Not to be mean or so, but two things I'd like to point on your post.

- Unless your husband is a killer-excellent RDM, Summoner has outDPS RDM for al stormblood by quite a large advance. If you look at *coughcough*Logs*coughcough*, a high tier RDM will have a lower personalDPS than a SMN at the same high tier, by a good margin.
- the everlasting non-argument of "BuT I cLearEd it EaSy!" Ranjit duty was no problem for me... at all. No food, no pots, and quite a low iLvl (I had a lot of XP from various sources but I didn't rund dungeons so I stuck with my 400 ilvl until I got my AF 80 (don't do that by the way) )

Bonud edit: solo duties are here to teach something. Failing a MSQ duty generally means that your gear is too low, or you don't understand what to do or you don't meet the expected DPS output (can be gear, but most of the time it's about the rotation. Like those countless complain threads of Will of the Moon duty where people had a low-side DPS and could not clear it).

So my take on this, reading your post, would be that there is something wrong in your DPS output. My number one advice would be don't hold the trances. Your flexibility is Bahamut in that kind of duty, but holding a trance means delaying the next one. These are your burst phases (especially Phenix) so you want to milk every occasion to get in trance. DoT uptime, Ruin 4 proc management are the little things to top up / polish the DPS.

I'll agree that 5.0 SMN is a bit "harder", or let's say busier. It's not 30seconds mini phases anymore, the flow has changed to something a bit more active. I personally love it that way... anyway, try identifying your DPS gaps and it should fix the problem

[Darkseth]

same. i went into Ranjit blind as smn, sold most coffer gear in Market and only used dungeon gear if any droped (except the first 2-3 coffer gears, and weapons). So i had not the highest iLVL.
No food or anything. easy fight, oneshot.

[NovaBismarck]

Thank you for your thoughts. Yes, I am aware of where rdm sits next to smn. Yes, he is an exceptional rdm. Of that I was already aware. This is the rotation spreadsheet that I have been practicing: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...aring&sle=true

Overall, yes my gear was too low for the fight. I was aware of that going in. I didn't grind multiple dungeons to gear up and I was sitting at a low ilvl, but so was he. I don't mind grinding, but wanted to just try the fight as is. I am not sure how much of the fight flaw was low ilvl vs mistakes made in rotation. I know I did get stuck with R3 phase at the end of the fight and could not make the damage to win, about line 92 in the rotation. It goes back to the original point of the OP, yes there is a lot going on. It was a point that I was trying to ineloquently state.

I'm your standard longtime casual player. I'm a cancer survivor and a handicapped player. I understand my limitations overall. Casual players matter too and someone has to speak up for them. I'm just speaking to my experience to add to the conversation. Overall, I see people who play this game in the high tier smn range who also see some issues with the rotation but I'm waiting to see the numbers and what the pros say before I weigh in too much on what should or should not be done. Then I'll adjust accordingly.

[Kolsykol]

I feel like Egi assault 1 and 2 are a totally unnecessary addition, especially considering how low the potency is.
More buttons doesn't = better and more enjoyable imo.
It pretty quickly ends up feeling bloated and annoying.

[ksuyen]

A good thing being busy is you don't become a mindless zombie... have you tried mindlessly pressing a few same buttons over and over and over... Well if that's your thing, I have nothing to say.