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  1. #181
    Player
    Reynhart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Ul'Dah
    Posts
    4,605
    Character
    Reynhart Kristensen
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Dualblade View Post
    Thanks for the update. I love my DRK, but these potencies are becoming ridiculous o_O
    (1)
    Y: I usually compare FFXIV with a theme park, but the Forbidden Land of Eureka won’t be a place where everyone would want to go. For example, there are people who don’t want to go to horror houses because they don’t see the point in getting scared on purpose. For example, on a date, the boyfriend might want to invite the girlfriend to go the horror house, but the girlfriend just doesn’t seem to find it fun. In other words, it’s not like everyone wants to go to the horror house, but there are people who just love the adrenalin rush they get from it. Think of Eureka as something like that.

  2. #182
    Player
    Valic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    720
    Character
    Venan Rehw-dvre
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    Glad Carve & Spit is keeping it's DA'd potency, 200 felt very underwhelming.

    If I'm completely honest, if they could remove Delerium, or give it a unique effect that doesn't make it feel like WAR's Inner Release, I'd be at least "ok" with the changes. Maybe make blood weapon's duration longer or it's cd shorter though considering everything prior to 60 is leaning on you having to use syphon strike and BW for MP regain.

    Now if I could do something PERSONAL with DRK... I'd want to give it a very dar black-blue aura on DRK while it's under the effect of walking dead so it's at least noticeable. Or make an added bonus that you can esuna walking dead OR just raise hp to their cap. OR just make it so when you hit 0, you're invinc for 5 seconds after and that's that.
    (1)

  3. #183
    Player
    Chrono_Rising's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    922
    Character
    Gulvioir Muruc
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 80
    Where is this from? Their warrior rotation could use some tweaking, dark knight needs verification on if the darkside bonus applies and if it is flat potency as multiple people have noted and the rotation could use some tweaking as well. Looking at paladin and I wonder why the requiscat buff is handled directly on the potencies and applied to requisite instead of acting like the Fight or flight buff. Does anyone have video evidence of requiscat buff back applying to itself? I just have alot of questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valic View Post
    Glad Carve & Spit is keeping it's DA'd potency, 200 felt very underwhelming.

    I'm also 90% sure the carve and split was a tool tip error, if you calculate the potency from the moves shown in the media tour it seemed to be doing as much damage as other 400 potency moves.
    (2)
    Last edited by Chrono_Rising; 06-28-2019 at 04:13 AM.

  4. #184
    Player
    WhyAmIHere's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Gridania/Lominsa
    Posts
    950
    Character
    Mute Shellback
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Xan_Kriegor View Post
    You can just check in the job tab the potencies the sheet is considering and compare with the Job Guide from the FFXIV site:

    https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/jobguide/darkknight/

    At least for DRK, all actions seem to have their potencies updated. Probably the sheet was made after the media tour and then updated to take into account the final numbers. It is possible that some calculations are wrong or using some incorrect assumptions but you should read it more carefully before saying things like that.
    Or whoever made that could, i don't know, update the thing.
    (1)

  5. #185
    Player
    Xan_Kriegor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    65
    Character
    Xan Kriegor
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono_Rising View Post
    Where is this from? Their warrior rotation could use some tweaking, dark knight needs verification on if the darkside bonus applies and if it is flat potency as multiple people have noted and the rotation could use some tweaking as well.

    I'm also 90% sure the carve and split was a tool tip error, if you calculate the potency from the moves shown in the media tour it seemed to be doing as much damage as other 400 potency moves.
    It was posted on Reddit today after the complete patch notes with the final potencies:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...comparison_50/

    You can check the "DRKSkill", "PLDSkill" tab in the sheet with the potencies from Job Guide section of FFXIV official site:

    https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/jobguide/battle/

    Regarding the Darkside buff: the methodology uses a multiplier effect of 1.1 potency. Carve and Spit and all other actions from DRK used on this sheet are correct with the values presented on the Job Guide. I have not checked it for the other jobs, but it is easy to verify with the "JobSkill" tab. Carve and Spit is 450 potency. There are some assumptions regarding WAR crit/DH and other few things that may not be very accurate, but it is an estimation regardless.

    I am not bringing this just for the sake of PPS balance discussion. With all the potencies and full patch notes being released we can finally discuss (without any doubt) the rotations and optimizations of tank jobs gameplay in Shadowbringers (which is the main point of this thread).

    Quote Originally Posted by WhyAmIHere View Post
    Or whoever made that could, i don't know, update the thing.
    Yeah, they could. But they did not. I am just bringing this because I think it might be useful for our discussion, and I have confirmed that at least for DRK the potencies seem correct. I am not trying to spread "bad information" or anything like that.
    (1)
    Last edited by Xan_Kriegor; 06-28-2019 at 03:59 AM.

  6. #186
    Player
    Chrono_Rising's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    922
    Character
    Gulvioir Muruc
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Xan_Kriegor View Post
    It was posted on Reddit today after the complete patch notes with the final potencies:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...comparison_50/

    You can check the "DRKSkill", "PLDSkill" tab in the sheet with the potencies from Job Guide section of FFXIV official site:

    https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/jobguide/battle/

    Regarding the Darkside buff: the methodology uses a multiplier effect of 1.1 potency. Carve and Spit and all other actions from DRK used on this sheet are correct with the values presented on the Job Guide. I have not checked it for the other jobs, but it is easy to verify with the "JobSkill" tab. Carve and Spit is 450 potency. There are some assumptions regarding WAR crit/DH and other few things that may not be very accurate, but it is an estimation regardless.

    I am not bringing this just for the sake of PPS balance discussion. With all the potencies and full patch notes being released we can finally discuss (without any doubt) the rotations and optimizations of tank jobs gameplay in Shadowbringers (which is the main point of this thread).
    I'm not talking about tweaking numbers, though some are clearly different. There are things not confirmed in this pps analysis. Also that link doesn't work... The link now works.

    Dark Knight
    - Does your Darkside buff apply to Living Shadow? How does Living Shadow interact with trick attack? Does it freeze in like a dot, or is it acting like Bahamut or salted earth? Why do I care? This effects when it should be summoned.
    - Is the Living Shadow's potency the same as our potency? From video evidence it appeared to be flat damage. On this sheet it seems to be assuming we get damage based on our potencies on the moves. This is not confirmed or denied on the known information or skill sheets.
    - Living Shadow looked like it had a long animation lock for both our character and until it took action. I don't think we will be able to double weave as indicated on the sheet.
    Thats what I mean by tweaking

    Warrior
    - Only looked at the opener, but this is not the opener I would use. It looks like an attempted was made to keep count of infuriates, but it looks like they missed one, I believe they missed this and therefore lost at least one Inner Chaos which is upwards of 1500 to 1800 in the openner.


    Paladin
    - Ok I'll admit I read into the numbers. From the job guide:
    Requiscat: 550 potency
    Holy Spirit: 350 potency
    Confiteor: 800 potency

    From the sheet linked
    Requiscat: 825
    Holy Spirit: 525
    Confiteour: 1200

    Why is the requiscat buff being applied to these moves directly instead of moves like Fight or Flight being handled in the buff column? Its more of a presentation issue. But how/why is Requiscat have its application buff applied to itself? Is this correct, how do we know this is correct?

    I have no sense of gnb, I'm holding my opinion.

    Also, these are just some general notes I'm making looking at these numbers, especially for paladin, these sheets don't tell the full story for damage. For example skill speed buffs apply to goring, fight or flight also effects autoattacks. These numbers look closer than I think they actually are. I'm all for starting analysis, I'm just saying this is presented as the final word, no warning as to what they are testing, what they are unsure of, what might change, or what assumptions they are making.

    I am not saying you are spreading bad information, I editted my above post to show who I was replying to for each part. I am just interested in the source didn't mean to cast shade.
    (1)
    Last edited by Chrono_Rising; 06-28-2019 at 04:14 AM.

  7. #187
    Player
    whiskeybravo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    2,840
    Character
    Whiskey Bravo
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 100
    PLD numbers on that spreadsheet seem incredibly bogus. 50% boost only applies when MP is +80%, which it won't be after 3 holy spirits. So Confiteor will never be 1200 potency unless using it within those 3 opening spells under Req.

    Aside from that, I don't know if it's still a thing but early on a high end PLD friend was speculating about Req opener to try to fit Confiteor in with trick.
    (0)
    Last edited by whiskeybravo; 06-28-2019 at 04:08 AM.

  8. #188
    Player
    Chrono_Rising's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    922
    Character
    Gulvioir Muruc
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by whiskeybravo View Post
    PLD numbers on that spreadsheet seem incredibly bogus. 50% boost only applies when MP is over 80%, which it won't be after 3 holy spirits. And Confiteor will never be 1200 potency unless using it within those 3 opening spells under Req.
    I think what the wording of the buff means is that, "If, when requiscat is used, MP > 80%, you will recieve a 12 second buff to your magical damage". I don't think you need to keep your MP above 80%.
    (3)

  9. #189
    Player
    Reynhart's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Ul'Dah
    Posts
    4,605
    Character
    Reynhart Kristensen
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by whiskeybravo View Post
    PLD numbers on that spreadsheet seem incredibly bogus. 50% boost only applies when MP is +80%, which it won't be after 3 holy spirits. So Confiteor will never be 1200 potency unless using it within those 3 opening spells under Req.
    The bonus applies if your MP is above 80% when you use requiescat, not during the buff.
    (3)
    Y: I usually compare FFXIV with a theme park, but the Forbidden Land of Eureka won’t be a place where everyone would want to go. For example, there are people who don’t want to go to horror houses because they don’t see the point in getting scared on purpose. For example, on a date, the boyfriend might want to invite the girlfriend to go the horror house, but the girlfriend just doesn’t seem to find it fun. In other words, it’s not like everyone wants to go to the horror house, but there are people who just love the adrenalin rush they get from it. Think of Eureka as something like that.

  10. #190
    Player
    Xan_Kriegor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Posts
    65
    Character
    Xan Kriegor
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrono_Rising View Post
    I'm not talking about tweaking numbers, though some are clearly different. There are things not confirmed in this pps analysis. Also that link doesn't work... The link now works.

    Dark Knight
    - Does your Darkside buff apply to Living Shadow? How does Living Shadow interact with trick attack? Does it freeze in like a dot, or is it acting like Bahamut or salted earth? Why do I care? This effects when it should be summoned.
    - Is the Living Shadow's potency the same as our potency? From video evidence it appeared to be flat damage. On this sheet it seems to be assuming we get damage based on our potencies on the moves. This is not confirmed or denied on the known information or skill sheets.
    - Living Shadow looked like it had a long animation lock for both our character and until it took action. I don't think we will be able to double weave as indicated on the sheet.
    Thats what I mean by tweaking

    Warrior
    - Only looked at the opener, but this is not the opener I would use. It looks like an attempted was made to keep count of infuriates, but it looks like they missed one, I believe they missed this and therefore lost at least one Inner Chaos which is upwards of 1500 to 1800 in the openner.


    Paladin
    - Ok I'll admit I read into the numbers. From the job guide:
    Requiscat: 550 potency
    Holy Spirit: 350 potency
    Confiteor: 800 potency

    From the sheet linked
    Requiscat: 825
    Holy Spirit: 525
    Confiteour: 1200

    Why is the requiscat buff being applied to these moves directly instead of moves like Fight or Flight being handled in the buff column?

    I have no sense of gnb, I'm holding my opinion.

    Also, these are just some general notes I'm making looking at these numbers, especially for paladin, these sheets don't tell the full story for damage. For example skill speed buffs apply to goring, fight or flight also effects autoattacks. These numbers look closer than I think they actually are.
    Fixed the link now, sorry it was my bad.

    I have the same doubts as you. I just know the assumptions the author of this sheet made, but I don't know the real interaction between the spells that we will only be able to see after Shadowbringers launch. The author is assuming that Living Shadow actions have the same potency as ours and that they are affected by Darkside buff.

    Regarding the Requiecast, for some reason they applied the 50% buff directly into the base potency of the action instead of doing a multiplier. Don't know why. We can ask them in Reddit if we want.

    Anyway, I am more interested here in the GCD and oGCD rotations. What do you guys think ? It seems to me that from our 12th to 24th GCD it will be really boring.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynhart View Post
    The bonus applies if your MP is above 80% when you use requiescat, not during the buff.
    Exactly.
    (0)
    Last edited by Xan_Kriegor; 06-28-2019 at 04:15 AM.

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