Will they ever bring crowd control back?

[SleepyNeko]

I don't see the point of CC, it just slows dungeons down for zero gain, dungeon trash is already boring but to have to CC means you will need to single pack pull. CC is not hard and all it takes is a marker to stop people from hitting the CCed mob, people complain about players waking mobs up is because the mobs are not marked because no one expects or needs a CC. Also not every class has a CC so it'll cause certain classes to be favored over others.

I think interrupts is a much more active way to increase difficulty and interactivity, something like Seiryu's Ad phase where you need to coordinate the interrupts.

[Kaethra]

Well this isn't EQ so what they do there (or any other game) cannot always be adapted over so easily. It's common to say something is "easy" to apply, but then if it was it would have been done already, and that goes for many things in FFXIV, (which some people often seem to claim is easy to do but this isn't a thread for making comparisons).

Basically CC offers close to nothing other than a small degree of mastery over enemy positioning (in certain situations), that's it. If something can be handled with damage as opposed to control effects, players are going to go for the former because that's what reigns supreme in this game, damage. Even now the bare minimal CC is done only if a mech requires or otherwise if it can be skipped, players will do that.

I've observed it in THIS game. We used to sleep adds. In dungeons like Dzaemel Darkhold, Haukke Manor, and Brayflox's. Leveling dungeons, in the duty finder, with PUGs. Back when our gear wasn't so great on average and potency of abilities were a bit lower.

[TaleraRistain]

I've observed this to be false.

If noobs on an EQ progression server can play a chanter properly. Applying CC in FFXIV would be easy.

To be fair, part of that is because the consequences for NOT playing an enchanter properly are pretty severe. And non-enchanter group members also very quickly find out why it's a bad idea to break a mez. We used to Sleep/Repose in earlier ARR because we didn't have the ilevel to cheese those mechanics. Just like you did NOT hit a mezzed mob in EQ, you did NOT wake up the big dragon in Brayflox. Because the consequences for doing so when that tactic was popular were severe enough to serve as a deterrent.

So CC wouldn't be quite as easy to implement, since you need that consequence to make it a required function.

[MrKusakabe]

I once accidently pulled two additional mobs by backflipping (Displacement) into their range in Aurum Vale as my camera was mis-aligned and I didn't notice my Lalafell's back was actually facing 45° off-center. As the healer was struggling with the current speedrun pull I did not want to get those two foes into the crowd and figured that 20 seconds are enough as most of our enemies were almost dead.

So I cast

which is on my hotbare since ever; voilá, they are out of comission until we are done. I thought..

For some reason, my tank is attacking them - they were just sitting 30 yalms away with the visible ring and static sparks - to mobilize them again, the mobs join the frey that is already massively in their favour and then the tank dies just a couple of seconds later. I cast Tether again to keep the foes off my allies and myself but now the length is only 10 seconds as they've been rooted by me before and so the funny running "back to the tank that just has respawned" sequence begun.. Sometimes I need the "Benny Hill Theme" on my hotbar for these situations...

So I am not sure if the design of the game or their players fail when it comes to that, but I'd like to see more CC in general. If my fellow players would not attack anything they see without checking ressources and/or general poor decision making..

Sincerely,

[Shurrikhan]

Man I just was recently reminded of when CC was a thing, you could sleep mobs etc etc. You guys think that will ever make a comeback? I would love some more CC control elements.

Do I think it will? No. Not at all.

Do I wish it would, especially if it comes with the surrounding repolish to make it and similar functions of play hugely compelling? Absolutely.

[Shurrikhan]

Well this isn't EQ so what they do there (or any other game) cannot always be adapted over so easily. It's common to say something is "easy" to apply, but then if it was it would have been done already, and that goes for many things in FFXIV, (which some people often seem to claim is easy to do but this isn't a thread for making comparisons).

Basically CC offers close to nothing other than a small degree of mastery over enemy positioning (in certain situations), that's it. If something can be handled with damage as opposed to control effects, players are going to go for the former because that's what reigns supreme in this game, damage. Even now the bare minimal CC is done only if a mech requires or otherwise if it can be skipped, players will do that.

Damage works both ways. When the enemies' damage is so high that the healer can only ever afford to stream out nuke heals and may eventually exhaust their MP or that the tank can never afford not to turtle when CC isn't used, CC then becomes a competitive or even optimal damage option.

There is no fundamental issue with the concept of CC -- only tuning issues in the content into which it would be obligatory, applicable, wasteful, or anywhere in between.

[Allegor]

I'm just saying, not that it matters, but specially now that I've ran Castrum and Prae an ungodly amount of times, it feels (felt) good to cast Sleep and Tether* on the bazillion adds and save some trouble.


*RIP Tether, you weren't as bad as people wanted to make you believe

[Wolwosh]

Sleeping adds never worked, there was always someone that hit the adds even with a red X don't hit marker.
People don't even follow markers in 70 alliance so ...

[Kalise]

CC will likely never come back to MMO's.

People complain when they can't just mash their face over the keyboard and zerg through a game.

Should it come back?

If implemented well, yes. Since it adds an increased level of depth, thought and tactics to otherwise monotonous trash that don't do anything special because they all need to be mindless zerg friendly...

This would go beyond "Just Sleep mob X and then don't hit it" since that isn't really adding much other than frustration when Zergy McZergface comes and spams his AoE's and clips the sleeping dude and wakes them up. (Or if you follow Ye Olde WoWe style, Sheep one mob, Freezing Trap another, Hex a third, Repentence a fourth, Shackle/Banish/Hibernate/Bind a race specific fifth. With potential for ghetto hard CC from like Entangling Roots on a melee dude for a 6th CC. Also with the really old school Mind Control usage to not only lock down a dangerous target but also then use them for evil to help deal with the trash pack (Such as MCing a healer mob to push out insano healing, or MCing a mage dude who'll blow up the other trash better than actual Mage players))

But stuff like silencing healers to prevent them from healing/buffing their allies. Pacifying dangerous ability based enemies. Using Stuns effectively to mitigate damage. All alongside standard interrupts as well as various forms of soft CC to mitigate damage (Such as Slow, Blind, Knockbacks > Binds *Cough*Fluid Aura*Cough* or Heavy).

It's just... This would require for them to make trash actually dangerous and interesting. As well as add enough tools to jobs to allow them to actually accomplish this.

Also, likely would also require for trash to live longer so that there's actually merit to CCing rather than tossing a handful of Flares into a pack and having them all fall over.

With the final point being, to also make these things relevant for in boss fights too, so that you don't have a ton of vestigial skills that are only relevant for trash packs (Given that we seem to be limited to like 2-3 AoE skills, this seems like an actual concern for devs. Instead of you know... Making more encounters with AoE requirements to help justify more interesting AoE rotations)

[Ilyrian]

Was this game ever designed with CC in mind?
Genuine question.