I don’t hate the new Astro changes

[gman1311]

I never understood the hate for Astro’s new card system. Half the cards are situational at best and the other half were simply better.

The Bole - A very situational and never comes out at the right time, and wasn’t very good as a royal road. I usually slap this on the tank if I didn’t have any other choice.

The Ewer - A really good card if another healer just died or lucid dreaming is still on cool down, if not, I burn it.

The Spire - Nothing like drawing this card the third time in a row! Useful in dungeons if running with melee or a warrior, if not, burn it. I personally hate this card with a passion because of the rng gods giving me this card the 4th time!

The Spear - it’s alright.

The Arrow - BLM’s wet dream.

The Balance - Best card in the deck! Every Samurai’s, Blackmage’s, and Warrior’s wet dream. The card that is universally loved by all!

Balance = this is the greatest thing since sliced bread!

Other cards = meh

Seems like Astro is going to play the same, but I got to be more mindful who I give these cards to.

[HyoMinPark]

I feel like people who say the other cards are worthless have clearly never tried to play AST at a higher level, or they think that Balance is the only one that matters because they haven't considered the niches of the other cards.


In the end, nothing can beat a pure damage buff. Numerically speaking. But that doesn't make the other cards useless. Honestly, the only real useless one was Spire, since TP became a non-issue outside of AOE situations where one DPS is doing all the work. But they could have changed that to something else (like perhaps Direct Hit).

AOE Boles can be useful for progression in raids, as the extra mitigation can allow one to survive to see more mechanics should things not be going as smoothly as they should. My UwU prog had plenty of these because we were just trying to see more mechanics.

Spear is a wonderful card on any job that loves Crit - BRD especially. AOE Spear has been better this expac due to Crit scaling on all the jobs. It's only really useless on WAR because of how IR works (but only during their IR window).

Balances are always AOE'd. In the event one draws another Balance and already has one in their spread, they are supposed to give it to the highest damage dealer OR a job that is currently in a burst window. Not necessarily a SAM or BLM automatically.

AOE Arrow is kind of meh, in my opinion. It can really mess with the rotations of some jobs (MCH, NIN, PLD), and only effectively works on a few (BLM, SAM). If a person has a higher GCD, it can also cause clipping (never forget when an AST gave me an enhanced Arrow while I was in Army's Paeon - at 4 Repertoire, I had a 1.74 GCD...no thanks).

Ewers are nice for progression as well, either for the AST or their co-healer (or a RDM who has been Raising or recently died). It's handy to have on AST since we struggle so much with MP. Especially if things aren't going well.


I really dislike that the developers took away any semblance of planning or thought process behind the cards, as that was what attracted me to the job back in Heavensward. I also do not like the idea of padding a single person with cards. The issue was clearly just Balance...but instead of addressing it, they changed every card into mini, weaker Balances... I can't quite understand this decision.

[gman1311]

I never said the other cards were useless(expect spire), they never came up at the right time to be useful.

[HyoMinPark]

I never said the other cards were useless(expect spire), they never came up at the right time to be useful.

That’s how RNG works. You can’t always draw the best cards—but that doesn’t make them any less valuable. If you don’t need the card, they make good Minor Arcana fodder for free damage or a free heal. But, as I said, all decision making is going out the window in 5.0, and I don’t like the idea of padding one person with cards.

[Brandedblade]

That's the thing. Outside of the Balance, Spear, or Arrow. The other 3 cards where niche in their value. So while there was always a potential use for all of the cards, them being locked behind RNG meant you couldn't reliably use them, and in the situations you drew them and had no need for them? They were tossed for setting up a damage card. And even among the damage cards one of them had more value then the others due to being a straight damage buff.

I completely understand the fact that the old card system has that cycle of highs and lows that makes it very appealing to certain players. But the card rework is, too me, a nessecary evil for the sake of balancing the rdps contribution of AST.

[Ephryos]

Just my personal preference but I always love classes that have situational utility. Having skills that increase dps is great and very useful but it doesn't make myself as a player feel very excited. I don't mind the Astro changes and it'll still be my preferred healer role in the expansion, however a lot of the utility that I had fun with on situational occasions is now gone.

Just as an example one of the things I love to do when you get that random Bole card in a dungeon is to use it with the extended Royal Road and combine it with Eye for an Eye and your hots, then extending them all with Time Dilation and Celestial Opposition. You basically make your tank unkillable while you can just freely dps for about a minute or more. Even in dungeons with undergeared tanks it ends up taking a lot of the stress off because of how you can compensate for their gear discrepancy. Is it the optimal way to use those abilties, probably not. But it sure feels rewarding and impactful to myself as the healer because it's easy to see the difference in how much I had to heal with the Bole card compared to without it.

I think people just need to remember that everyone playing this game is doing so to have fun and different playstyles and abilities are fun to different people for different reasons. People being upset that something they enjoyed is changing doesn't make them wrong or right, it just makes them human people that are sad about seeing something they care about change. All things change with time and we will grow along with them, but I will miss that situational utility that first brought me to enjoy the Astrologian and I will probably always miss it on some level.

[HyoMinPark]

I completely understand the fact that the old card system has that cycle of highs and lows that makes it very appealing to certain players. But the card rework is, too me, a nessecary evil for the sake of balancing the rdps contribution of AST.

If AST still has decent personal damage and the cards still offer an advantage over WHM, the meta will likely still be AST/SCH. WHM will have to beat AST in personal damage AND beat the raid contribuation to make it pull ahead. If it doesn't, then nothing was changed. That said, for pad runs, AST will always be preferred because WHM still doesn't offer any sort of raid buff.

I don't see WHM/Noct AST becoming a thing, because Nocturnal Sect still suffers from the same thing it always has: it's less efficient in terms of MP per healing potency compared to Diurnal Sect. If MP costs were reduced when in Noct, then I think it would maybe have a chance, but they seem to be staying the same. That said, there will need to be coordination because ASTs and SCHs regarding shields and Neutral Sect, since Galvanize won't stack with Nocturnal Field.

[Brandedblade]

If AST still has decent personal damage and the cards still offer an advantage over WHM, the meta will likely still be AST/SCH. WHM will have to beat AST in personal damage AND beat the raid contribuation to make it pull ahead. If it doesn't, then nothing was changed. That said, for pad runs, AST will always be preferred because WHM still doesn't offer any sort of raid buff.

I don't see WHM/Noct AST becoming a thing, because Nocturnal Sect still suffers from the same thing it always has: it's less efficient in terms of MP per healing potency compared to Diurnal Sect. If MP costs were reduced when in Noct, then I think it would maybe have a chance, but they seem to be staying the same. That said, there will need to be coordination because ASTs and SCHs regarding shields and Neutral Sect, since Galvanize won't stack with Nocturnal Field.

Iirc the Neutral Sect shield is a separate one called "Nocturnal Balance" so i doubt that will be the issue. I do have faith the extra damage on whm will be enough to at least keep it competitive. Not to mention the nerfs to sch's damage, chain, and embrace and the buffs to WHM and AST's regen should give them a similar advantage to SCH's ability to handle autoattacks.

[HyoMinPark]

Iirc the Neutral Sect shield is a separate one called "Nocturnal Balance" so i doubt that will be the issue. I do have faith the extra damage on whm will be enough to at least keep it competitive. Not to mention the nerfs to sch's damage, chain, and embrace and the buffs to WHM and AST's regen should give them a similar advantage to SCH's ability to handle autoattacks.

It’s hard to say. The tooltip from the media tour simply states that “Aspected Benefic and Aspected Helios receive the effects of both Diurnal Sect and Nocturnal Sect”. I would have to look at some of the videos to see if the buff is actually something different.

[Shurrikhan]

I never understood the hate for Astro’s new card system. Half the cards are situational at best and the other half were simply better.

Except, apart from Spire, the situational ones in their given situation were... the highest value cards. Bole can be spriggin' OP, mate, and when you need Mana, you need Mana.

And unless they're really milking the multi-DoT capabilities or oGCD burst damage (rather than a durationed buff burst window), Arrow is of nearly as much bonus to quite a few jobs. And it actually improves heals, where Balance cannot.

But, sure, instead of simply taking the small step to balance said cards and finally deal with 4-year oversights like random shorter durations... let's just given them all roughly the value of Spear or less. Now you can get that sub-optimal draw all the time! Just don't forget to have at least one melee and one ranged DPS in your every dungeon run!