DRG AoE combo issue

[Arkenne]

Potency difference is offset by the GCD speed actually, as NIN, MNK and SAM have weaker Weaponskills but they are faster than DRG.

SAM AoEs don't give you the Jinpu and Shifu buffs. They extend them. You have to have them running first, so gotta pursue a single target combo while doing a big pull to get the buffs then go for AoE once you have them. Same applies for MNK and maybe NIN (as they have the dirty easy life).

[Ing-Dono]

Also don't forget Dragoons get to throw Stardiver, Dragonfire Dive, Geirskogul and Nastrond into the mix, together with a party-wide crit buff and Lance Charge (15% boost)
I think Dragoons are not going to lag behind in the AOE department even if they lack the buff refresh on the aoe combo.

[Anselmet]

I don't understand why didn't they just put the buff on true thrust? Sure disembowel has always been our pierce debuff, but it's not anymore so would it really have mattered if true thrust suddenly got the buff? I mean, dragoon are all accustomed to stopping our aoe's to heavy thrust real quick so that would have been a quick solution. Or am I missing something? Would having a 10% dps buff up on our aoes break drg so they made it more of a hassle to get?

[Ing-Dono]

I don't understand why didn't they just put the buff on true thrust?

Putting the buff on True Thrust would mean you start both combo's with applying the buff, meaning they'd have to make it shorter to cover only half of your gcd rotation. Which would be a bit odd I think.

[Rongway]

Retracted.
PS: SE please be clearer with your trait tooltips.

I don't understand why didn't they just put the buff on true thrust? Sure disembowel has always been our pierce debuff, but it's not anymore so would it really have mattered if true thrust suddenly got the buff?

Presumably it's to encourage you to alternate combos during single target play. It's worth noting that the two complete six step ShB combos together take up 29.16s, which is 5.16s longer than the damage buff duration, which means that you will always do one Raiden Thrust, one True Thrust, and Disembowel at base potency. If the buff were granted by True Thrust instead, the single target rotation would do an additional 94 potency every 12 GCDs, or on average 7.83 potency per GCD. This is comparable to gaining two extra Jumps every three minutes.

[Ing-Dono]

Presumably it's to encourage you to alternate combos during single target play. It's worth noting that the two complete six step ShB combos together take up 29.16s

Hold on a second, six steps? Raiden Thrust is an upgraded True Thrust. From Raiden you can continue into the rest of the combo.
So if you can hit your positionals without fail, you'd only use True Thrust once in the entire fight, not counting stuff like transitions breaking your combo.
So your gcd rotation will only be 10 steps long [True > Disem > Chaos > Wheel > F&C > Raiden > Vorp > Full > F&C > Wheel], I currently have a gcd cooldown of 2.48, the full rotation would be 24.8 seconds long (assuming no faulty weaves etc.) while the 10% damage buff will come in after the second action, you should be able to keep it up 100% of the time if your sks is high enough. Worst case only Disembowel isn't boosted by the buff it provides.

[Rongway]

Hold on a second, six steps? Raiden Thrust is an upgraded True Thrust.

AHHHH that's what I was missing. Thanks. I just spent the last half hour cross referencing tooltips and spreadsheets to figure out why Raiden Thrust seemed so underpowered. Replacing True Thrust makes so much more sense. The Lance Mastery II tooltip would be better worded:

True Thrust is upgraded to Raiden Thrust if Fang and Claw is executed following Wheeling Thrust -- or vice versa -- while adhering to directional requirements.

[Anselmet]

Hey you two, thanks for answering my question! So it looks like ss is back on the menu then for materia melding?

[Ing-Dono]

AHHHH that's what I was missing.

Yeah I was pretty confused by it at first too.
Then I saw the icon for True Thrust change in the corner of my eye while watching a Shadowbringers Dragoon video.
Went through it frame by frame and indeed, it replaces True Thrust.
They definitely should mention that in the tooltip.

[mosaicex]

AHHHH that's what I was missing. Thanks. I just spent the last half hour cross referencing tooltips and spreadsheets to figure out why Raiden Thrust seemed so underpowered. Replacing True Thrust makes so much more sense. The Lance Mastery II tooltip would be better worded:

The Japanese tooltip is very clear with this (True Thrust turning into Raiden with the buff) so you can expect them to fix it in the release, heck it might already be fixed in the E3 build.



As for the buff duration, I do find it very weird they gave us such huge buffer in SB, only to take it away (and made it tighter even) in 5.0. I'm expecting some adjustment from the old media tour build, because as they have stated many times before, the numbers are not final yet.