I've kicked players for wearing the wrong gear!

[JackHatchet]

they could also use that gear to up there ilvl to be eligible for the instance there doing. i have friends who do this as well

Yeah, I get that, and if confronted they responded as such--It'd be a pass. It doesn't bother me when people try to get around the system like that if they're smart enough to play their class and know of those loop-holes. My pet peeves are the folks who ADAMENTLY believe that strength gives them crit or that INT increases their TP regeneration, and defend that stance with toxic responses.

I can understand why some people would think kicking is an extreme in a normal when you can just suck it up. However, I'm mostly just a no-nonsense type of person. The moment I realize I'm talking to a wall--I throw up the kick, and generally it passes. I don't think most people want to be that stern or "go that far." But honestly. I'd rather just vote them early on than wipe later or be resentful. So I just nip that stuff the moment it rears its ugly head.

I just don't understand how people can be so thick though when it's something so ingrained into the game itself. Picking the stats on your gear isn't a subjective choice--it's an objective one.

[Canadane]

I've removed a ninja for wearing str accessories back in HW.
I even asked him about it first, he said he didn't have any other gear.

Well sorry bud, we wanted a DPS not a DPH.

[Akira]

Yeah, I get that, and if confronted they responded as such--It'd be a pass. It doesn't bother me when people try to get around the system like that if they're smart enough to play their class and know of those loop-holes. My pet peeves are the folks who ADAMENTLY believe that strength gives them crit or that INT increases their TP regeneration, and defend that stance with toxic responses.

I can understand why some people would think kicking is an extreme in a normal when you can just suck it up. However, I'm mostly just a no-nonsense type of person. The moment I realize I'm talking to a wall--I throw up the kick, and generally it passes. I don't think most people want to be that stern or "go that far." But honestly. I'd rather just vote them early on than wipe later or be resentful. So I just nip that stuff the moment it rears its ugly head.

I just don't understand how people can be so thick though when it's something so ingrained into the game itself. Picking the stats on your gear isn't a subjective choice--it's an objective one.

so do you at least try to help them out before kicking?

[Jybril]

I've removed a ninja for wearing str accessories back in HW.
I even asked him about it first, he said he didn't have any other gear.

Well sorry bud, we wanted a DPS not a DPH.

What if he was trying to get gear from that dungeon?

[Baalfrog]

You forget some people play for something called fun.

FINALLY! Someone actually responded with this! I've waited so long to hear this! Ahem... So, here we go then! You are aware that fun is extremely subjective right? But, lets see now, so by your argument, if I don't play like you do, I am having fun wrong, and I need to change my ways of having fun, or it will ruin the community. Or something. WEEWOOWEEWOO! The fun police!

Let me elaborate on the fun argument here a bit. There are people who think grind is fun, who think optimization is fun, erp is fun, or something else that you might not like, and find it fun. So you are no authority on what others find fun based on your subjective views and then using that as an argument against someone elses point. Children ages 10 and up should know this.

Anyway, if you really enjoy carrying people and you think its fun, whatever, I'm not going to police your fun. And yes, you are coddling people who play like idiots if you don't correct their blatant errors. Effectively it also encourages that type of behaviour, since why should the bads improve since no one has bothered to correct them before.

[van_arn]

What if he was trying to get gear from that dungeon?

He should get gear from an npc before making a party suffer.

[JackHatchet]

so do you at least try to help them out before kicking?

Depends on your definition of help. I'll start off by asking them why they're wearing the wrong gear. And depending on the response we go from there. Like mention in previous posts. If the player is nice--they'll generally get a pass. Most people, and myself will tolerate a sub-par player if they're new, learning, or just trying to get by. As long as they're communicating in a reasonable sense.

The people I do kick are the ones who get incredibly defensive and toxic when asked. They're the ones who'll lace every sentence with profanity, or tell the group to 'get over it,' and expect a carry. Or again, legitimately think a stat does something it doesn't. And when confronted--defend that stance. You literally cannot help those people who refuse to be helped.

And I'm not here to coddle someone and explain it in 'simple words' for someone who's throwing profanity bombs at me or the group. It's not my job to over-extend myself to compensate for someone's terrible personality. I just kick them so they can be someone elses problem.

[Nedkel]

You're missing the point.

The point is, OP is simply overreacting to other people gameplay.

There is only one reason why someone could wear wrong gear and it is that they are lvling their job and have nothing to put on in the place so they wear anything they could.
It should not really be a deal, if someone is wearing 60 lvl accessories with wrong stat its really maybe about 10% in total dps output of the guy, the higher lvl the less impact it has on a dps since accessories comparing to armor does not give that much primary stat on lvl 70 in comparison to lvl 50 or 60.

[VillainQueen]

If the kick passes how is that an abuse of the system? Difference of play style is a valid reason GM's have confirmed this in the past. Also what is interesting you yourself mention that is it okay to remove someone if they "really drag the party down" clearly the group that passed the vote felt the lack of proper gear really dragged the party down that it warranted the removal of the player. Granted for you that may not count as dragging the party down so to speak the use of wrong gear, but for some it is. The line is drawn in different places for different people, but as you said removing someone that is really dragging the party is okay, so you support how the OP used the feature. Or do you feel only your subjective few as to what is dragging down a party is the standard we should use as a community?

Honestly baffles me when people say only valid reason for removing someone from a group is based around a non uniform metric. What you find as toxic or holding the group back vastly differs from person to person, and group to group.

That might be true... I do understand where you coming from. I define "really dragging down" as playing so bad that the party wipes but for having the wrong stats on a ring? Isn't that a bit too much? If the player can still pull his own weight and I personally don't care what they wear. Even it's a potato sack. I don't check others gear unless I see them tanking the floor a lot. After that I tell them they should gear up, if I get a rude answer I might votekick because I don't need that either or I simply ignore and carry on. But in my experience most people can be reasoned with and kicking them isn't really helping the situation in the long term either. I know some people that behave really elitist towards players with less experience and no one wants to be treated like that either and I personally think this way of kicking is kinda toxic. Like a bully on a playground.

[van_arn]

Depends on your definition of help. I'll start off by asking them why they're wearing the wrong gear. And depending on the response we go from there. Like mention in previous posts. If the player is nice--they'll generally get a pass. Most people, and myself will tolerate a sub-par player if they're new, learning, or just trying to get by. As long as they're communicating in a reasonable sense.

The people I do kick are the ones who get incredibly defensive and toxic when asked. They're the ones who'll lace every sentence with profanity, or tell the group to 'get over it,' and expect a carry. Or again, legitimately think a stat does something it doesn't. And when confronted--defend that stance. You literally cannot help those people who refuse to be helped.

And I'm not here to coddle someone and explain it in 'simple words' for someone who's throwing profanity bombs at me or the group. It's not my job to over-extend myself to compensate for someone's terrible personality. I just kick them so they can be someone elses problem.

God bless you for being the vaccine to the you don't pay my sub disease.