Reason i wont be playing Astro anymore after ShadowBringers launches.

[eiozza]

I like the new card changes, they seem more fun than the current cards. Only two out of the six cards are actually useful in most situations, and that to me isn't interesting at all. The other four (Bole, Spire, Arrow and Ewer) either have very specific uses that are only good for one or two jobs (Arrow only being good for BLM and SS SAM), Royal Road fodder or you just shrugging and going 'I guess I'll Minor Arcana it'. The cards that you want to draw, which are Balance and Spear, are pretty much the only useful cards in every situation. Though Balance being more important than Spear in this instance. Every draw revolves around these two cards and if you don't draw them what else do you have? Arrow? That is only useful on builds with SS and, currently, BLM is the only one in this game that benefits off of SS, a good chunk of jobs currently in meta hate SS because it messes up their rotation. Bole? During big pulls in dungeons it can be useful but in endgame you just minor arcana it, that's it. Spire and Ewer? Ewer has it's uses when you are low on mana but with the changes to lucid you should be fine. Spire is only good for when someone dies, other than that, royal road or minor arcana it. When I look at that system I just say 'Am I having fun on this job?'. And the answer is a no.

However, while I am interested in the new card system, seals need changes. One action every 180s when all your cards have seals? That's stupid. My idea: keep Time Dilation. Have it be a 60s to 90s (or less) cooldown and it uses seals, but still be able to use it without seals. Like at 0 seals it is a plus 5s to the card duration and it goes to 3 seals which is a plus 20s card duration. Maybe even have the seals be useful in healing as well?

I'm excited for the AST changes, and I think because of these changes I will be switching from SCH to AST as my main healer (because lets face it, SCH is screwed). Which is sad because I've been playing SCH since I started this game.

[ParadoxHealer]

All of the people talking about only balance or only 1 or two useful cards, completely miss the point of the AST mains who found all the cards useful. Our point, as has been explained multiple times, is that we enjoyed the challenge of the class, deciding how to best utilize whatever card we drew, whether that was using Royal Road, spread, or immediately placing it on an appropriate class. Changing the system for the people who just fished for one card is ridiculous because they were not the people maining the class. Maybe you guys did not notice when you had a good AST, but when I was BRD or BLM and got a spear or an arrow respectively, I knew the difference and enjoyed the thought by the healer. I will not just miss playing AST, but I will miss the benefits of the current AST system when playing other classes.

[Kabooa]

All of the people talking about only balance or only 1 or two useful cards, completely miss the point

No, we're well aware.

Fringe cases of use don't make a system more interesting, unless you want to argue Spire was great and had thought behind it that wasn't immediately RR'd or Redrawn.

[ForteNightshade]

snip.

It's not gone. They simply removed the terrible feeling of not drawing balance. I hate to break this to you but spear and arrow were severely worse than balance in every scenario.


With the new changes you're actually going to be getting more use out of the cards you draw, instead of treating the cards as balance fodder. You're focusing too much on the card effects being the same rather than the use they will gain, and mistaking diversity with illusion of choice.

Actually, while Spear was weaker than Balance, it wasn't by the significant margin you're insinuating. And in single target uses, it was actually preferred on Bard and Monk. An Enhanced Spear on a Bard in Mages was monstrously strong. Arrow only suffered because gameplay does not synergize well with Skill/Spell Speed. The current changes and addition of the Charge system could change the landscape in that regard. Furthermore, you wouldn't get many complaints from Samurai, Black Mage and even Monk with an Arrow.

Nevertheless, the "illusion of choice" is important to the overall feel. You were excited about Balances because you could get bad RNG. What's exciting now? Every card is guaranteed Balance, but weaker. Without the chance to "fail," the system can never excite. It will always do the same thing, no matter the circumstance. There were plenty of alternatives they could have explored. Perhaps have an ability that guarantees defensive cards or nerf/delete Balance—the actual problem child. That isn't to say this new system can't work. We will have to give it a whirl and see. I will say, it doesn't present itself as fun or engaging though.

They needed to keep the 6 cards for lore reasons, since the 6 arcana are a mayor point in the original job quest. would have been weird to have entire quests dedicated to learning the arcanas and then not actually having their cards anymore. However, that makes me curious how they are going to rework that lore part of the questline. "Ah the spear, it stands for halone and her increasing dmg." "and here we have the spire, representing dmg aswell. And this is Ewer, which contrary to the other arcanas, does represent dmg."

You mean the lore which outright states Bole "offers protection to the weak, defending them from harm." Bit contradictory to what it does in ShB, i.e. buffs Range and Caster DPS. Lore excuses are flimsy at best, and are only ever applicable when it suits the dev team. Case in point, male Keeper Miqo compared to Male Viera. Both are supposedly extremely rare to see in every day life but only one is so rare we can't have them as a playable race. Much like how Male Viera was a development issue (they wanted to make Ronso instead) not a lore issue. The cards are a technical one. They simply don't want to go back and change the quests. So "lore" even if the wording doesn't make much sense now.

[Rahspdoy]

Only two out of the six cards are actually useful in most situations, and that to me isn't interesting at all.

So only having 1 single coin to flip 'is' interesting?

Even when its all said and done, it doesn't matter 'which' face of that coin lands up, you can just toss it on anyone because it really doesn't matter if it lands on heads or tails as now your 'fishing' for seals so you can get a 'group' version of that 1 single buff?

Thats what i dont understand.

The people who are 'for' the change all claim that all they ever did originally was 'fish for balance'. Yet somehow feel that having only 1 option, and nothing else, is somehow more 'fun' or 'interesting' than having multiple choices.

If all we have is 1 choice on what we 'can' draw. Why even make it a card system? Just make it a insta-cast skill with a 20-30 second cooldown, and have the 8% group buff be a single insta-cast skill with the 180second cooldown.

Grats, you have the same 'fun' system you are all advocating for only without the fancy UI element to make it seem as if its actually something more.

There is no 'fun' in that for me.

[ParadoxHealer]

No, we're well aware.

Fringe cases of use don't make a system more interesting, unless you want to argue Spire was great and had thought behind it that wasn't immediately RR'd or Redrawn.

So essentially for other classes where people do not play the class the way it was intended we should dumb down the class. Great, all tank classes should be dumbed down to essentially 3 attacks for enmity and 3 blocks for defense for those people who do not understand when to block, how to control enmity, or cool downs.

[ElZombo]

So essentially for other classes where people do not play the class the way it was intended we should dumb down the class. Great, all tank classes should be dumbed down to essentially 3 attacks for enmity and 3 blocks for defense for those people who do not understand when to block, how to control enmity, or cool downs.

The easy version of the Astrologian exists; its the White Mage. If anyone played Astrologian and thought "This RNG is terrible, its no fun at all dealing with these cards" - then TA-DA, we have the White Mage, better healing potency, none of the RNG, beautiful.

.The worst part is, all the seals lead up to just the same 6%, which in dungeons is unbelievably unsatisfying, as well as the crap AoE range. Black Mages adjust.

I also dont get how people thought bole and ewer were useless? It depends on the situation, sure clearing trash packs, admittedly Balance meant we could get through it quicker, but when everyones running around getting battered by AoE's a bole was so satisfying, knowing my tank just got beefier so i can heal that Samurai crying in the corner. And a ewer after getting ressed made for those moments i played the class for.

[Kabooa]

So essentially for other classes where people do not play the class the way it was intended we should dumb down the class. Great, all tank classes should be dumbed down to essentially 3 attacks for enmity and 3 blocks for defense for those people who do not understand when to block, how to control enmity, or cool downs.

I'm not saying the current system is better, just that the old system wasn't 'more' interesting.

If you needed bole, ewer, or spire, someone messed up. Plain and simple. And you're not going to hold those three cards on the assumption someone is going to mess up. You're going to RR or Redraw and boost up the people -not- messing up.

That's the problem with cards. They can't be necessities so long as they're an RNG mechanic. Imagine if Bole was required for a tank to survive a buster, but you drew Balance instead. Or anything that singles out a non-tank.

What this means is that nothing is a necessity, and when nothing is a necessity, the cards with the most amount of useful "use cases" wins.

Want to guess which card that was?

[eiozza]

So only having 1 single coin to flip 'is' interesting?

Let's put it this way: I rather do a coin flip than quickly learn the definition of insanity by pulling Bole, then redraw as Spire, then draw a Bole again... then redraw as Ewer. Yay more minor arcana uses I guess. So yes, I do find it more interesting then internally screaming on why a Spear or a Balance won't come out due to my crappy rng. It's less of 'RNG BAD' it's more of 'I don't need most of these cards with the content and raid set up I am running with'. That's the main flaw with AST, most of the time the cards are worthless. Though I do agree that changing everything to balance isn't the best, and they should've reworked the system in a different way. What way? I dunno. Maybe make each card contribute to the party a bit better but still keeping some core effects to make things more interesting.

[illumy]

i kinda like the current Astro or maybe cause i really love time mage and seeing astro using time mage skills was awesome but i think Gunbreaker stole my heart soo far