About Party Member Kicking...

[DumdogsWorld]

Before I begin, there are two things I should make clear:

-This is not a rant/venting/comedic thread. Forums are for discussion. I'm here to discuss.

-I take pride in not being a "terribad" player, but I am the very first to admit that I could improve my play style in many ways. Also, I am usually the first one to admit my mistakes.

Anyway, here goes...

I see complaints about unjust kicks everywhere. Not just here, or on Reddit. I see them everywhere. Now, whether or not they're truly unjust is, at least in my opinion, irrelevant to what I'm about to ask.

Right. I'm not asking about who is right and who is wrong, but rather - how do these posters manage to get into these situations in the first place? I'm genuinely asking here and not being sarcastic or whatever.

I started this game not knowing anything about traditional MMOs and have worked myself up slowly ever since, and as such, have ranged everywhere from "I have no idea what to do" all the way to "I have a moderate grasp on fundamental gameplay concepts for this game." Not once has a kick ever gone through for me with me as the subject. Maybe somebody has tried it at some point, but I've never been removed from a party.

So why is that? Am I just lucky? Is it because I tend to not say much? Because I'm a DPS? I mean, I'm sure somebody has had a beef with me somewhere along the line. Am I missing something?

[Fawkes]

So why is that? Am I just lucky? Is it because I tend to not say much? Because I'm a DPS?

Yeah, probably.

[van_arn]

-I take pride in not being a "terribad" player, but I am the very first to admit that I could improve my play style in many ways. Also, I am usually the first one to admit my mistakes.

This is why this doesn't happen to you.

I don't kick all that often, but if I do it's usually because someone's starting drama. Even if it doesn't go through (it usually does), it does a fantastic job of stopping the drama cold.

[DarkMasamune]

Usually, I kick people who are disrespectful, AFK (in raids for exemple), disconnected and didn't come back for quite a while, obvious trolls, stuff like that.

Been playing since 2.4, I never got kicked once. I mostly keep to myself, help if needed and do my job in cooperation with the rest of the group. I guess that's all it takes to be "safe from the kick" : know your job, work in team, be respectful and don't start drama

[Enla]

Most people are pretty understanding in this game and the cases of legitimate griefing due to the kick-party feature are few and far in between. They still happen, but most people generally only kick for trolling, harassment, or being AFK for too long without a party member to vouch for the absence.

[Gemina]

If you are respectful and courteous to others, it is very unlikely to happen to you. However, being respectful and courteous doesn't just entail that you're a 'good guy' who is polite. It also means that in content you respect the time of other players and ensure you're not dead weight for them to carry to a clear.

As a DPS you do your rotations as best as you can and use your full toolkit to also support the party. As a tank you hold aggro, position enemies correctly, and don't sit in tank stance and just toss out aggro combos; you also try your best to add to the damage pool and not put added pressure on the other members of your group. As a healer you keep players alive, quickly raise the ones yo don't, cleanse debuffs, and you use your downtime to add damage using your offensive kit to the best of your ability.

Other things you do is make sure you are adequately equipped for the instance (players will be checking your gear), say it is your first time or a returning player, and own up to your own mistakes. Things you don't do is point fingers, cause drama, allow instigative players to make you retaliate, or otherwise the opposite of everything else I've mentioned. If you're a good guy and a good player, no one in their right mind is going to kick you, or even commence a vote for you to be kicked.

[Krotoan]

Reasons I support kicks:
You aren't doing your job at all. If I see you just standing there and your resource bar isn't moving for several pulls? yeah. YOu deserve a kick.
You are being actually abusive. Nobody deserves abuse in a game. No matter how bad the player the solutions can be addressed civilly.
You are AFK or Disconnected for more than 5 minutes without a reason given. Sure your house might be on fire.. cool, we have no idea and it's a game. You'll be fine. Ok maybe not but the least of your worries is the run.

otherwise if you're trying and we're progressing without drama, cool.

[Greven]

Being good player, from silent to courteous, and not alone, like playing with friends, gives you way less chances to be kicked.

Even if I'm sure you're not doing it on purpose, it feels like you are shifting the fault of being kicked to the victims.
I usually kick for prolonged AFK/DC, bad trolls, abusive behaviours and similar things.

Still as it entails human interactions there's always some degree of luck involved:

When Arboretum was the DR Expert it happened that the friend playing with me was kicked and it was unjust:
I was tanking, as most of the time, people seemed okay so I greeted and proceeded to pull everything. I died at the first pull. I know my job and I try my best from cycling defensive CDs, positioning mobs the best for everyone DPS etc. I Checked if SCH gear and it was okay, slightly better than mine. I tried again and fail but this time I noticed I was receiving 1 Physick every 2-3 seconds if not more and Eos Embraces. I asked if everything was okay and received no answer, started doing the smaller possible pulls but it was so annoying and I told the healer they should start healing properly or asking if they needed time, the BLM DPS answered aggressively right away, the other DPS was my friend and highlighted that the SCH was in follow on the BLM, doing a Physick every 3 secs and that I almost died in the group of Korpokkur before the boss. Guess what happened, other then insults they kicked my friend. I didn't know until there that 2 people can manage to kick one in a party of 4, then the BLM started arguing with me, I guess he didn't want to lose a tank halfway. I left and reported obviously, the GM even answered me at the time.

During HW times, I was levelling SCH, and in The Vault I had this DRK hating on Selene, still not sure why, we never died and not even risked to but he was more and more insisting, I asked what was his problem and he insulted me heavily in another language (one I understand) adding to remove Selene or I would get kicked. Seeing that there was no reasoning I changed to Eos but he tried to kick me as well, luckily the rest of the party voted no.

Another time me and another pug were kicked because friends of the party, mostly made by the same FC, were arrived.

Another time I was kicked randomly because 3 people wanted to leave but somehow the vote abandon didn't pass (to which I voted yes anyway).

Nothing against the last two, just slight unjust that I was the one randomly kicked because I was probably the first in the list of the person that started the kick but the first 2 are examples there shows that there's only so much you can do. You don't know who you will find in Duty Finder and initiating kicks are not necessarily the elitist, but everyone, terribad players included. It's not even about the majority sometimes as you can see.

[LalaRu]

The only kicks I initiated were only people that were or crystal clear trolling everyone else, or afk too much time.

[HyoMinPark]

Typically, people tend to kick players that want to start fights or drama (aside from the usual AFK/offline for too long dismissals). I only kick for people that are deliberately causing trouble, or for players that are leeching (e.g., back before 24-mans auto-zoned you in and some players would back out of a boss room to avoid participating).

The last kick I did was actually against an AST in Orbonne. I was on PLD, and I wasn't main-tanking any of the bosses; but they kept putting Boles and Regens on me. I told them they didn't need to do that since I was OT, and thy got so mad at me for "telling them how to play" that they refused to heal me during TGC and I died to the buster (no Esuna on the debuff and my Clemency didn't go off fast enough). After we wiped to TGC (because they were also refusing to heal most of the party due to arguing with a friend of mine in chat), we kicked them. Went through almost instantly. When you behave like that AST, that's when you should worry about being dismissed - though some groups just grin and bear it. Quite people that do their job and don't interact much are rarely targets for dismissals in my experience.