Tank entitlement vs group entitlement

[Faeona]

Most dungeons take around 20ish minutes to get through. Making bigger pulls does not do much if you party lacks key skills that burn down mobs more quickly. It's always going to come down to party composition and tanks will read that better than healers or DPS.

I remember a Sirensong party that could barely manage a pack of three mobs. DRG, BRD and WHM. They skipped learning some skills or perhaps story skipped as friends to that point. If that three-pack took an eternity, imagine pulling six or more! Whole run was just painful. Took 30 mins.

And time slows for tanks harder than DPS or healers. You know a group is just bad when a boss rotates through their attack script three or four times.

Even if the tank is bad or legitimately too conservative on pulls, kicking them means waiting on a new tank, adding to time you could be finishing said dungeon. Did you want this done quickly or just want to control what others do. Not all tanks set their search to join "in progress" because there's this superstitious notion the group left behind is bad where that usually is not true.

When you roulette, you shouldn't be expecting absolute perfection. If you want something fast and consistent, go with a premade group. Don't impose on random players. Most people want things done fast, but accept others may be learning or have different comfort zones.

[cicatriz313]

Most dungeons take around 20ish minutes to get through. Making bigger pulls does not do much if you party lacks key skills that burn down mobs more quickly. It's always going to come down to party composition and tanks will read that better than healers or DPS.

I remember a Sirensong party that could barely manage a pack of three mobs. DRG, BRD and WHM. They skipped learning some skills or perhaps story skipped as friends to that point. If that three-pack took an eternity, imagine pulling six or more! Whole run was just painful. Took 30 mins.

And time slows for tanks harder than DPS or healers. You know a group is just bad when a boss rotates through their attack script three or four times.

Even if the tank is bad or legitimately too conservative on pulls, kicking them means waiting on a new tank, adding to time you could be finishing said dungeon. Did you want this done quickly or just want to control what others do. Not all tanks set their search to join "in progress" because there's this superstitious notion the group left behind is bad where that usually is not true.

When you roulette, you shouldn't be expecting absolute perfection. If you want something fast and consistent, go with a premade group. Don't impose on random players. Most people want things done fast, but accept others may be learning or have different comfort zones.

Can't "skip learning" aoe skills. Conversation is about end game dungeons, every job has good AoE at end game. /thread

[Ilan]

Most dungeons take around 20ish minutes to get through. Making bigger pulls does not do much if you party lacks key skills that burn down mobs more quickly. It's always going to come down to party composition and tanks will read that better than healers or DPS.

I remember a Sirensong party that could barely manage a pack of three mobs. DRG, BRD and WHM. They skipped learning some skills or perhaps story skipped as friends to that point. If that three-pack took an eternity, imagine pulling six or more! Whole run was just painful. Took 30 mins.

And time slows for tanks harder than DPS or healers. You know a group is just bad when a boss rotates through their attack script three or four times.

Even if the tank is bad or legitimately too conservative on pulls, kicking them means waiting on a new tank, adding to time you could be finishing said dungeon. Did you want this done quickly or just want to control what others do. Not all tanks set their search to join "in progress" because there's this superstitious notion the group left behind is bad where that usually is not true.

When you roulette, you shouldn't be expecting absolute perfection. If you want something fast and consistent, go with a premade group. Don't impose on random players. Most people want things done fast, but accept others may be learning or have different comfort zones.

There is not a single party composition in this game that wouldn't make it worth to pull big. Tanks will also not always read it better that there isn't enough dps for big pulls because most people don't pay attention to how fast the mobs die not tanks, not healers and not dps.

IF your party skipped learning skills, which means they didn't do the job quests, the BRD would've stopped doing said quests before or with level 45 which means he misses a lot of important skills but still has a AOE skill.
The DRG would've stopped doing said quests before 50 which would result in him not learning Dragonfire Dive which is sad but he still has a AOE skill.
The WHM probably never dpsed but he learned every AOE skill without having to do a job quest.

No one here is really expecting big pulls in leveling dungeons because they hit most of the time harder than the level 70 dungeons and because people often have not the necessary gear thanks to the not existing required min ilvl to be able to enter the dungeon.
On max level and in level 70 dungeons every player, who has the required ilvl to enter and did his/her jobquests, is able to put out enough AOE damage to make big pulls worth. The only exceptions are those runs where both dps stay on their single target rotation, if they use one at all which is unlikely.