The Future of Zenos Yae Galvus(heavy spoilers for 4.5)

[SannaR]

I mostly want them to do something with him as he killed himself and then came back stole a body and a magitech flying gunner thingy and then took a few patches off only to get to our fight with Eldizenos too late. Like does that thing fly that slowly? I mean what has he been doing in the mean time? I get that they partly wanted to show how exactly the Resonance is to the natural echo by him not staying dead, but then it's like they didn't know what to do with him. At least with Fordola they sent her to do some primal slaying and give her time to gain some empathy of others and work on her road to redemption. It's not awesome, but at least it's someting. I mean heck Varis travels faster and has "done" more than Zenos has in his search for us and/or his body. Hopefully he ends up doing more then he has so far post death because right now he's in the why did they keep him around basket for me.

[Bright-Flower]

They might be going that route. And I agree, not every villain needs to be relatable.

But for me, if a villain is not relatable, they need to be interesting in some other way.

Kefka and the Joker (in some versions) aren't relatable but are entertaining in their own way. Or Palpatine from Star Wars who is so over the top and hammy evil but I love him anyway. Or hanibal lecter. Not 'relatable' but interesting.

Or a villain can be intimidating or scary.

For me though, Zenos just isn't any of these things. And the sad thing is he had the potential to be. He could have been a more compelling villain IMO if we knew something about his past in 4.0, but we don't. If we say got an echo flashback or two to show why he is the way he is, maybe I could have latched on to something. But there was nothing there for me to relate to.

And he wasn't intimidating or entertaining enough on his own for me personally to coast on that. Just another jrpg boss that we lose to because our power level isn't high enough but then later we can fight him for reals because our power level is higher now. There was nothing intimidating about him defeating us. Fordola IMO was actually done better this way because we didn't beat her by just vaguely becoming 'stronger' like a dbz protagonist. We came up with a plan to turn her gift against her.

The first two fights with Zenos don't make me feel scared, because the fights themselves are not difficult. They're an annoying grind whittling away at a wall until the game arbitrarily decides we've whittled away enough of that wall and he's going to 1 shot us now. Furthermore, from a story angle our losses to him hold no impact because they have no real consequence.

At Rhalgrs Reach one minor named pc dies and Yshtola is hurt, but that's it. The resistance isn't even force to flee. He just...gets bored and leaves. The resistance still holds RR and he never bothers to drive them out. It makes him feel disinterested and bored as a villain which are not compelling traits for me.

In the end, he talks about a 'hunt' in ala mhigo but that hunt is just him sitting in the throne room waiting for us to come to him.

There was potential for Zenos but it all just fell flat for me. He wasn't compelling, he wasn't entertaining, and any potential intimidation factor was cut short by the way his fights played out and the lack of meaningful story consequences for losing to him.

I hope they do better with him in 5.0 onwards if he's sticking around. The direction his story is going in COULD be interesting. But only if they execute it well.

I mostly want them to do something with him as he killed himself and then came back stole a body and a magitech flying gunner thingy and then took a few patches off only to get to our fight with Eldizenos too late. Like does that thing fly that slowly? I mean what has he been doing in the mean time? I get that they partly wanted to show how exactly the Resonance is to the natural echo by him not staying dead, but then it's like they didn't know what to do with him. At least with Fordola they sent her to do some primal slaying and give her time to gain some empathy of others and work on her road to redemption. It's not awesome, but at least it's someting. I mean heck Varis travels faster and has "done" more than Zenos has in his search for us and/or his body. Hopefully he ends up doing more then he has so far post death because right now he's in the why did they keep him around basket for me.

I like to (jokingly) headcanon that the reason it took him so long was that he wasn't attuned to aetherytes and kept flying back and forth from Eorzea to Othard after us every time the MSQ sent us back and forth.

[Cilia]

Zenos has two points to his character: he is a dark reflection of the Warrior of Light, and he is the embodiment of the Empire's sins.

Regardless of why, the fact remains that the Warrior of Light has dived into battle after battle after battle and grown stronger for it. This is the same thing Zenos does, though depending on the player's reasoning they might have diametrically opposed reasons for doing so. If one gets meta he might be considered a bit of meta-text, asking the player as much as the Warrior of Light why they're so willing to engage in so much bloodshed.

Other hand, the thing tying the antagonists of Stormblood together thematically is that they were created by the societies in which they lived. Yotsuyu became what she was due to Doman culture; Fordola became what she was due to the clash of Ala Mhigan pride and the Empire's endeavors to whittle that away into nothing. Zenos is the culmination of everything wrong with the Empire - a rabid beast who knows nothing but war and conquest, because that's what Imperial culture promotes over everything.

Going forward? He's likely going to be the X factor that keeps the Alliance standing, whether they know it or not, thanks to his overwhelming combat strength.

[Daralii]

Zenos has two points to his character: he is a dark reflection of the Warrior of Light, and he is the embodiment of the Empire's sins.

Regardless of why, the fact remains that the Warrior of Light has dived into battle after battle after battle and grown stronger for it. This is the same thing Zenos does, though depending on the player's reasoning they might have diametrically opposed reasons for doing so. If one gets meta he might be considered a bit of meta-text, asking the player as much as the Warrior of Light why they're so willing to engage in so much bloodshed.

Other hand, the thing tying the antagonists of Stormblood together thematically is that they were created by the societies in which they lived. Yotsuyu became what she was due to Doman culture; Fordola became what she was due to the clash of Ala Mhigan pride and the Empire's endeavors to whittle that away into nothing. Zenos is the culmination of everything wrong with the Empire - a rabid beast who knows nothing but war and conquest, because that's what Imperial culture promotes over everything.

Going forward? He's likely going to be the X factor that keeps the Alliance standing, whether they know it or not, thanks to his overwhelming combat strength.

He also sets up a B plot going on on the Source while we're over on the First and both sides are at a stalemate in Ghimlyt. I'm expecting at least one role playing instance of him in Garlemald.

[JeanneOrnitier]

I have to agree with Bright-Flower. I think Zenos is extremely one-dimensional: not threatening as a villain, and not interesting as a character. All he has to him is the blood knight thing. He could develop more in the future, but as things currently are I just roll my eyes whenever he's on screen and have done so ever since we first met him.

Losing badly to him at Rhalgr's Reach but then beating him at the end of the MSQ when nothing had actually even changed between those fights except we gained 10 levels especially bothered me.

[braxberry]

I honestly couldn't agree more. I felt like Zenos was just uninteresting and wasn't intimidating to begin with, and having him come back after his apparent suicide just seems incorrect. Doubly so, since now there are "two" of him.

Frankly, it seems like a lazy attempt to keep a lukewarm antagonist relevant, just because his assets are convenient.

[Cilia]

In my opinion, Zenos' appeal has less to do with his in-universe impact than his meta text and what his character says about Garlemald and Varis.

Can't say I'm particularly happy he survived his suicide, since I don't know what role he has left to play beyond being an anomalous factor in the antagonists' plans... but unpredictable things are interesting to me, so... ehh.

[MagiusNecros]

There's an Elezen in Resistance garb walking around using a katana yammering on about the Hunt and searching for his one true friend, his one true enemy--and at the end of 4.56 we see his eyes light up with two Resonance symbols. The only other person we've see with two Resonance eyes is Zenos. There's very little subtlety here, the Elezen possesses Zenos' soul by some means, and the most likely explanation is the Resonance--as the Echo can allow a person to persist after death (as seen in 2.2's Sahagin Priest).

So basically he's just there and showed up out of nowhere. With no explanation whatsoever or build up. What an asspull.

[JeanneOrnitier]

I think it's dumb to have him survive, but it's not an asspull. We've seen the Echo possess people since as far back as that Sahagin. Heck Zenos himself showed it when he controlled Shinryu.

[Iscah]

So basically he's just there and showed up out of nowhere. With no explanation whatsoever or build up. What an asspull.

How much leadup do you need before something doesn't appear out of nowhere, though?

Admittedly Rocl's explanation hasn't laid it all out as sequentially as it has been revealed to us.

We had the very early example of the Sahagin priest, gifted the Echo by Elidibus, who was able to transfer his soul into another body after being killed. He was promptly consumed by Leviathan, so only really existed to demonstrate that it's possible.

Then we have Zenos's death at the end of 4.0 and apparent resurrection in 4.2, and all the while we're speculating whether it's him, or an Ascian, or perhaps a clone.

And just as 4.3 gives us confirmation that "Zenos" is in fact Elidibus, they drop a wildcard on us: the "katana-wielding soldier", whose dialogue sublty indicates that he is possessed by the soul of the real Zenos - who apparently wasn't planning on still being here after his death, but somehow it happened anyway.

The pieces fit together - we know Zenos has the artificial Echo, and we know the Echo can let souls transfer into different bodies.

In 4.5 we get further confirmation (or a second hint for those who missed the first one), seeing that he retains his Resonant eyes.

And that's where we are now. We don't know exactly what he's planning, beyond targeting the Empire in some way, but he's likely to be a 'loose cannon' in 5.0 and I'm interested to see how it plays out.