Can we report the Baldesion Arsenal discord group?

[YutiKyis]

I think there may be some confusion which can come across as elitist which is why this misunderstanding happens.

While it may really suck to hear, BA is one of the few places where an alive person who is unfamiliar with the mechanics is actually a net negative and where choosing to leave someone dead is a necessity to clearing.

The final boss, Proto Ozma, has multiple spells which effectively are a full-party wipe. These are all mechanics people should be familiar with from other fights but the punishment for failing them is VERY harsh not to just to the person but to the entire party. (Meteors and Acceleration bombs for everyone, adds and orbs for off-tanks.)

Telling someone not to raise in BA is not done to be cruel but because they fear that person will kill not just themselves but the entire BA group running, most of whom have spent at least an hour and a half getting to that point.

This *does* make it hard for newcomers to learn the fight but unfortunately that's the same issue with most hard content. You just need to look at PF to see that farm parties rarely if ever allow people who haven't completed the duty to join. (And that's officially sanctioned by S-E!) It really does suck that learning content is that punishing for people who were behind the curve but it's a hard problem to fix without offering rewards to people for taking that risk.

However I think it needs to be stressed: BA is content designed around the idea that if you screw up (or get unlucky) you don't get a second chance. Every method of resurrection is costly (in terms of gil and possibly time) and in the final two bosses there are mechanics which if done incorrectly can kill other people who haven't failed any mechanics of their own.

[Alucard135]

(intentionally letting people in open content die just for being there)

How do you intentionally let someone die though? They all die to boss mechanics. You have Eurekan potions, wisdom of the platebearer, and cure logograms to take care of yourself without problems there. Just do the mechanics right. No one can get you killed there except your own self or someone else failing a mechanic that not only kills you, but a good amount of players with you (like failing acc. bombs or meteors, which is what is feared from snipers who don't know the fight).

You're not in a 4 man or 8 man raid where the healer has to heal you. You entered a public dungeon with a huge warning message that it's hard.

[jameseoakes]

ok now we are getting ridiculous with the healing thing its not easy to go through 54 other people to target a random person to heal while one shot mechanics are happening that is not harassment if they died there is such a thing as priorities and healing party > healing random person

Agreed but it was explicitly that intentionally not healing someone due to them not being in your premade was acceptable, which it isn't.

[Xellos2099]

The issue with sniper, some of then run healer logogram, hit the boss once and just ignore the rest of the fight, which put a huge strain on the main group for av. If someone have zero experience in ozma, no elemental gear sniper in av, it is not nice but it is technically better if the sniper die. A good group might be able to survive orb explosion in the middle but it will wipe at ozma and potentially hours of work. One time i think the group ask someone with zero experience on av/ozma to stay out of ozma fight , not sure what happen but i think the sniper refused and basically wipe the raid with meteor. There are also something that pop up in primal sever- I dub it anti-discord discord group. A group of player who is in their own party and discord and specifically target discord group portal.

[Stanelis]

Being a bad healer isn't reportable. Saying in chat you're going to let that person die while you are a healer and could've prevented that probably is.

Generally snipers get one shotted ^^

[Xellos2099]

I think there may be some confusion which can come across as elitist which is why this misunderstanding happens.

While it may really suck to hear, BA is one of the few places where an alive person who is unfamiliar with the mechanics is actually a net negative and where choosing to leave someone dead is a necessity to clearing.

The final boss, Proto Ozma, has multiple spells which effectively are a full-party wipe. These are all mechanics people should be familiar with from other fights but the punishment for failing them is VERY harsh not to just to the person but to the entire party. (Meteors and Acceleration bombs for everyone, adds and orbs for off-tanks.)

Telling someone not to raise in BA is not done to be cruel but because they fear that person will kill not just themselves but the entire BA group running, most of whom have spent at least an hour and a half getting to that point.

This *does* make it hard for newcomers to learn the fight but unfortunately that's the same issue with most hard content. You just need to look at PF to see that farm parties rarely if ever allow people who haven't completed the duty to join. (And that's officially sanctioned by S-E!) It really does suck that learning content is that punishing for people who were behind the curve but it's a hard problem to fix without offering rewards to people for taking that risk.

However I think it needs to be stressed: BA is content designed around the idea that if you screw up (or get unlucky) you don't get a second chance. Every method of resurrection is costly (in terms of gil and possibly time) and in the final two bosses there are mechanics which if done incorrectly can kill other people who haven't failed any mechanics of their own.

Discord group have learnign pt daily at least on my data center. New learner can always join those.

[QuinceTaru]

Q: Yeah about that, you know the only way to raise in BA is sacrifice right? So maybe it wasn’t just that they were being dicks?

A: No no I know about sacrifice. It wasn’t that they didn’t raise me, it’s that they told people not to raise me. As in, I stayed to watch the rest of the fight and after they killed AV I used return to leave and shouted for a raise and the people started shouting not to raise me cause I took their spot and it’s my own fault I’m dead.

This makes me think this didnt even happen, cause this isnt how this works. They would have had to time out to get kicked out, but that is impossible since they clearly say the group killed AV which adds time to the BA timer.
Ive been in plenty of BA groups in Aether where if a rando person is trying and actually wants to learn we get them into a party and teach them mechanics, we go out of the way to make sure we arnt toxic or anything because threads like this try to split the community.

[Alucard135]

Discord group have learnign pt daily at least on my data center. New learner can always join those.

Even on Aether. But noooooooo we gotta take a portal from support group directly to AV and hope to be carried for the mount. /s

[YutiKyis]

Discord group have learnign pt daily at least on my data center. New learner can always join those.

This is absolutely true! I think it's true of all Discord groups. I was mostly referring to random joiners in this case.

I genuinely think (and this just doesn't apply to BA) if you want to learn content you should find learning groups. Most people on FFXIV are very nice and willing to teach you if you ask and they have time. More to the point BA is a good thing to learn on as the first two bosses are *very* easy mechanically (on par with dungeon bosses at the worst) and finishing them gets you 12 frags on its own (plus a shot at cloth/seal) which is a great way to build up your elemental gear.

[Xellos2099]

This is absolutely true! I think it's true of all Discord groups. I was mostly referring to random joiners in this case.

I genuinely think (and this just doesn't apply to BA) if you want to learn content you should find learning groups. Most people on FFXIV are very nice and willing to teach you if you ask and they have time. More to the point BA is a good thing to learn on as the first two bosses are *very* easy mechanically (on par with dungeon bosses at the worst) and finishing them gets you 12 frags on its own (plus a shot at cloth/seal) which is a great way to build up your elemental gear.

I always see people die at Art and Raiden even in clear group