Gender locked race?

[Wolfyboy]

we need both! it is the only solution!

I don't have issues with both; however, I'm in the odd camp of being pro gender lock short term. I feel that Au'ra weren't made as bestial as they could have been because they thought about the female's design first due to the quote, "players are prioritizing cuteness" (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/46936). When a race is female focused it feels it is more confined to a certain mold where males will be played despite more difference between them. Now, they can simply make a new race first focusing on the male design, however, I feel that in the back of their minds they'd be like, "Well this feature wouldn't look good on the female counterpart!"

Think about it, despite not wanting to do Viera in Heavensward was due to wanting something more bestial ("they didn't look beastly enough, they were just a little too cute" Reason for not wanting male Viera). The first character they put out to introduce Au'ra was a cute female, and now the first thing we see of Viera is the female too, which makes sense in this case. (The "infamous" interview about Viera being to cute https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/the...n-sense/.91021)

I rather they focus on Hrothgar, if they do exist, as a male race so that they don't have to feel the restrictions about worrying about making a female version that will be popular with the majority of the female character players. That way they can make them as bestial, rugged, hairy and scared as they want them to, and that they don't have to worry about restricting their creative freedom by wanting to make a mass appeal female version which would dumb down the males due to possible complaints about sexual dimorphism.

[Lacan]

I don't have issues with both; however, I'm in the odd camp of being pro gender lock short term. I feel that Au'ra weren't made as bestial as they could have been because they thought about the female's design first due to the quote, "players are prioritizing cuteness" (http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/46936). When a race is female focused it feels it is more confined to a certain mold where males will be played despite more difference between them. Now, they can simply make a new race first focusing on the male design, however, I feel that in the back of their minds they'd be like, "Well this feature wouldn't look good on the female counterpart!"

Think about it, despite not wanting to do Viera in Heavensward was due to wanting something more bestial ("they didn't look beastly enough, they were just a little too cute" Reason for not wanting male Viera). The first character they put out to introduce Au'ra was a cute female, and now the first thing we see of Viera is the female too, which makes sense in this case. (The "infamous" interview about Viera being to cute https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/the...n-sense/.91021)

I rather they focus on Hrothgar, if they do exist, as a male race so that they don't have to feel the restrictions about worrying about making a female version that will be popular with the majority of the female character players. That way they can make them as bestial, rugged, hairy and scared as they want them to, and that they don't have to worry about restricting their creative freedom by wanting to make a mass appeal female version which would dumb down the males due to possible complaints about sexual dimorphism.

Yea, that does make a lot of sense. Sadly, I don't think they're going to be willing to make the race very bestial regardless, just because of the expectations of the male playerbase. If they're being offered as a substitute to male viera, I imagine they want the race to be as appealing to a large number of people as possible. I think they tend to design the males with consideration of what women find attractive as well, that's why most the races are slim and conventionally good looking.

I think the furthest they'd go with Hrothgar would be giving them fangs and manes, and maybe a thin coat of fur. Anymore than that and they stand to lose too much of the audience with them. I could be completely wrong though!

[Wolfyboy]

Yea, that does make a lot of sense. Sadly, I don't think they're going to be willing to make the race very bestial regardless, just because of the expectations of the male playerbase. If they're being offered as a substitute to male viera, I imagine they want the race to be as appealing to a large number of people as possible. I think they tend to design the males with consideration of what women find attractive as well, that's why most the races are slim and conventionally good looking.

I think the furthest they'd go with Hrothgar would be giving them fangs and manes, and maybe a thin coat of fur. Anymore than that and they stand to lose too much of the audience with them. I could be completely wrong though!

There is a potential market with the term "WoW refugees" for a more bestial option. It doesn't help that WoW players see this game as husbando and waifu simulator which would keep a decent portion of them away from trying this game in the first place, so they wouldn't even have a voice within this community. Here is a question, despite partly pulling from people who like Final fantasy games, why do Galka have a far more healthier population in FF11 then Roe in FFXIV.

https://ffxiclopedia.fandom.com/wiki...tatistics_2006 7.76% (2006)
http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/gui.../12/index.html 7% (2014)

Now, I fully believe that this is due to a higher population in general; however, I feel a big contribution is that they took away the charm of Galka and ruined them in FFXIV. There is nothing wrong with having a healthy niche race in a MMO, but you need to cater towards that niche which I feel this game failed to do.

[MrKimper]

There is a potential market with the term "WoW refugees" for a more bestial option. It doesn't help that WoW players see this game as husbando and waifu simulator which would keep a decent portion of them away from trying this game in the first place, so they wouldn't even have a voice within this community. Here is a question, despite partly pulling from people who like Final fantasy games, why do Galka have a far more healthier population in FF11 then Roe in FFXIV.

https://ffxiclopedia.fandom.com/wiki...tatistics_2006 7.76% (2006)
http://www.playonline.com/ff11us/gui.../12/index.html 7% (2014)

Now, I fully believe that this is due to a higher population in general; however, I feel a big contribution is that they took away the charm of Galka and ruined them in FFXIV. There is nothing wrong with having a healthy niche race in a MMO, but you need to cater towards that niche which I feel this game failed to do.

That goes against the whole beastmen not being allowed within city states thing, if they do that they'd have to redact more lore than I feel they'd have to just to add in male viera. Since anything more beastial than miqo'te would be really towing the line.

[Theodric]

That goes against the whole beastmen not being allowed within city states thing, if they do that they'd have to redact more lore than I feel they'd have to just to add in male viera. Since anything more beastial than miqo'te would be really towing the line.

Raen and Xaela are fairly bestial, so I could easily see something along those lines and perhaps even slightly more bestial looking. Given that a Miqo'te is essentially just a Hyur with cat ears and a tail tacked on, it wouldn't be particularly difficult to design a race that is more bestial yet not completely monstrous.

I mean, the most played races in that are NE, BE and human, and not by an insignificant margin, either, so if they see it that way, that's rather funny.

I've no interest in them myself, though let's not pretend as if there isn't a notable chunk of people playing WoW who flock to the monstrous races. On that note, by this point quite a lot of people who used to play WoW have since ventured to FFXIV.

[Lauront]

Raen and Xaela are fairly bestial, so I could easily see something along those lines and perhaps even slightly more bestial looking.

The boys, maybe. The girls are cosplaying.

[Wolfyboy]

That goes against the whole beastmen not being allowed within city states thing, if they do that they'd have to redact more lore than I feel they'd have to just to add in male viera. Since anything more beastial than miqo'te would be really towing the line.

I feel that the developers have been making us feel more sympathetic to beast races in this game. We see a dragon save a little girl from a cruel Elezen, we have the tempered goblin that Alisaie is trying to save, we have Hien who leaves his country to a Lupin and even in the newest lore book (I don't have it but I've read people mention this) that the person who wrote it feels that they unfairly categorizes beastmen and the so called "human" races. Now I don't know all of the lore, but I believe it was Ul'dah that has restrictions on beastmen but from the BLU quest line we know it is specific named beastmen and not all of them.

I mean, the most played races in that are NE, BE and human, and not by an insignificant margin, either, so if they see it that way, that's rather funny.

It isn't considered waifu/husbando simulator due to a lot of players playing the regular popular races. They call it that due to there being no options outside of races that are the typical popular ones. There isn't an insignificant portion of players who play the "ugly races" that apparently only 0.1% (As I've seen mentioned) would think of playing.

[Shougun]

That goes against the whole beastmen not being allowed within city states thing, if they do that they'd have to redact more lore than I feel they'd have to just to add in male viera. Since anything more beastial than miqo'te would be really towing the line.

Booo lore stopping fun things from happening, booo lol. Not a fan of redaction but I'm sure they can figure something out. Besides how awkward (imo) races already get added to cities. "BEASTMEN NOT ALLOWED", suddenly we have beastmen and no one has bat an eye.

I guess I'd put it this way, lore made it not apparent HOW a summoner could have better egi but it did NOT prevent it (bahamut egi). There was lore against making it easy, but lore doesn't make it impossible in almost all cases. What makes it interesting is good writing changing the world, like new technology in our science. It can happen, but something clever making it work would be nice.

Lore stopping more beastly races, imo, is a very flimsy defense to stopping a more beastly race. Only thing stopping a beast race is lack of creative writing, imo - not the lore.

I mean, the most played races in that are NE, BE and human, and not by an insignificant margin, either, so if they see it that way, that's rather funny.

Yes but also notably you should consider that no. The most played in total races are the pretty races, and that seems to be true everywhere.

However if you total the beastly races against pretty then nearly half of the playerbase is beastly (non-standard). Also looking at older statistics it looks like this "other group" stays pretty consistent but spreads out as more options are added.

So it is true that pretty is a high demand item but it is also true that there are A LOT of WoW players who play a non-standard "not pretty" race. We already have pretty races, we don't really have ugly / beastly / unusual (lala and roe push that a bit but imo their FFXIV variant is far more standard human than FFXI, so I'd say it barely pushes it).

[Lauront]

Yes but also notably you should consider that no. The most played in total races are the pretty races, and that seems to be true everywhere.

However if you total the beastly races against pretty then nearly half of the playerbase is beastly. Also looking at older statistics it looks like this "other group" stays pretty consistent but spreads out as more options are added.

So it is true that pretty is a high demand item but it is also true that there are A LOT of WoW players who play a non-standard "pretty" race.

It's closer to 30%, and that is in a game where they have very well established background lore. I mean, what are "non-standard pretty" races? Draenei more or less have the same faces as blood elves, who in turn, along with night elves, boast some rather unique features... they are just also conventionally attractive in all three cases. Gnomes are cutesy, like lalafell. Dwarves are not the most beautiful race but neither are they bestial or ugly. If we really dig down as to where the "bestial" races are most popular, it's orcs, tauren and forsaken, which have a pretty strong lore presence in the earlier Warcrafts. I know there's plenty of "muh old Horde" er... "devotees", who have some sort of superiority complex because they don't play a "pretty" race (even though they'll use the prettiest face pick on their troll or orc femme), but it's a bit odd to surmise that merely adding a race closer to what they would play will suffice to lure them to the game, when it's not just the race but its history and lore in the setting.

Au ra are a non-standard pretty race, as it is.

I just question the logic that adding a race will be the incentive to lure such players over. Female Viera will probably do far more in that regard given the average WoW player's preferences.

The other thing to keep in mind is that WoW is still a western MMO. FFXIV is still an eastern MMO at the end of the day. I can't imagine them designing a race that their primary audience isn't going to like very much just to try and attract these "WoW refugees" to the game. I mean, are they that hard up for money? :v

And that's only the subset of those WoW refugees who simply want a more "bestial" race and that's the only thing preventing them from subbing. I think it's a stretch, to say the least.

[Shougun]

And that's only the subset of those WoW refugees who simply want a more "bestial" race and that's the only thing preventing them from subbing. I think it's a stretch, to say the least.

I'd argue that it would be a severe stretch too that the only thing preventing people from subbing is an "even more pretty race" then (Viera).

But that's not really important point to me (not a great point to argue against viera for lol). I believe SE getting new blood is an important resource to tap, because they can then get them into the sub cycle and cash shop cycle. Vs people who would already be buying cash shop and paying their sub. This is why I suggested they might be gender locking on two races rather than making one full "pretty" race though. Here they keep people in the cash shop cycle and subbing/buying expansion for that and then also drawing in new blood because SE has a void when it comes to "weird" (imo).

Also it depends on if you count dwarves, gnomes, and dranei as weird or not. Imo they are weirder than FFXIV's but you may or may not consider them. Either way you get 36%+ or 49% if you count them. That's a pretty good number either way.

36% (or more depending on how you count it) of a group you're not addressing at all is a lot when you consider the other 70% you are addressing very well (FFXIV is loaded with pretty already).

Although I wouldn't suggest that if WoW refugees is why they're going this route is the only reason why. I'd also say its because FFXIV already has a bunch of pretty races, so not just for WoW but for other players who are not represented at all. Adding a race to a void that exists vs adding a race to a very bountiful area.

That doesn't mean people wont switch to it (Viera), I'm sure there will be loads of fantasia money, but it does mean that there is an audience that isn't represented and possibly able to bring in new blood or make FFXIV a better home than before as they weren't represented. Au Ra concept art I think could have met that, but the current Au Ra.. I really don't agree that they're weird, especially the females lol.

To add I'm not saying I want them to bar adding male Viera because of this. I'm just saying that addressing the void, addressing the refugee leak of players who don't have an equivalent race (we have blood elf/night elf equivalent), and also adding more pretty (Viera female), could be a legitimate albeit annoying game plan.

Adding both genders to two very visually different races would be the "epic" game plan.