Idea regarding new and old jobs...

[Brightamethyst]

The problem is that, as SMN/SCH proved, that doesn't really work and is more trouble than it's worth.

[Shurrikhan]

The problem is that, as SMN/SCH proved, that doesn't really work and is more trouble than it's worth.

To be fair, a sample size of one with ridiculous implementation issues and a number more problematic design choices not directly caused by the two jobs sharing a initial base class hardly proves or disproves anything. SCH and SMN did not need to share EXP, yet were specifically designed to do so. As Stormblood now shows, they didn't even need to share skills verbatim (they can be retroactively changed from the shared Arcanist base, adapting or even trimming skills), yet did so for all of ARR and HW.

Doubling up on classes accomplishes three things:
- Allows casual players their choice of role within a single leveling process. (Doesn't necessarily have to be the case, especially if the jobs merely share a starting class, rather than being linked themselves.)
- Allows players their choice of role within their favorite aesthetic.
- Allows jobs which have similar fundamentals prior to their job elements (e.g. Ranger being very different from Bard in all things job related, but not in that they both shoot arrows and can kite) to be developed.

Yet the first is usually seen as problematic, the second can be achieved with greater overall efficiency for the playerbase by just creating further unique jobs to get to love, and the third is merely a common sense check that isn't really needed until we've ran out of other ideas.

[Jandor]

The problem is that, as SMN/SCH proved, that doesn't really work and is more trouble than it's worth.

Hmm, works fine as far as I can see. Summoner and Scholar are both well liked jobs.

[Brightamethyst]

Hmm, works fine as far as I can see. Summoner and Scholar are both well liked jobs.

They are, but the system is a lot more clunky than it could be if they were both standalone. Neither is badly designed, but both would probably have been designed differently and more efficiently if they weren't connected.

Summoner feels like the natural progression of arcanist while scholar had to have almost it's entire healing kit built up through the job actions after the fact. It's why Succor is level 35, compared to level 10 for Medica and Helios. Why Esuna is now a role action (down from Leeches being level 40), etc. It works, but it's messy.

[Dmhlucky]

The reason they made Arcanist branch off is a bit of a mystery. Aside from the level 1 job and get 2, there wasn't much sense in it.
Don't get me wrong, i like the idea of being able to choose a role more or less, either heal or DPS, but there is a Steep downside to this. Since they are linked and if you only play 1 of the jobs. You won't know the other very well, and have it at the same level, which hits the same problem that bought accounts, or power leveled accounts have.

Its not as big of a problem in this game, as this game is a lot simpler to learn overall, but i have already seen my fair share of people who actually leveled the jobs, who don't know what they are doing, ex. A tank saying they wouldn't flash because the healer shouldn't get hate on the other mobs if the Blm wasn't AOEing them. Since the tank wasn't pulling hate, the whhealer wouldn't get hate from healing him... Which anyone who has even remotely looked at hate knows this is Not how it works.

I don't want a new wave of players who leveled one aspect of a shared job, to jump on the other and constantly wipe because they don't know the mechanics.

Honestly as much as it may be a hassle to level all of the jobs independently, that's how you learn them.

But then you also delve into which roles to merge on 1 job. And wasted abilities. Overall SE did a great job not making abilities and spells obsolete, with the exception of a few, so giving a tanking ability that ends up on a healer, or DPS is somewhat pointless, or a Cure potancy boost on a DPS. Yes they could save them for post 30/50 whenever the break is, but then the job is limited compared to its counterparts before then.