Community Opinions on Tanking

[Shurrikhan]

I mean you either want it a holy trinity combat system or you dont. And seeing how anything non-holy trinity has horrendous pve content imo i rather want i to stay that way. I always find it odd how tanks (and healers) are expected to dish out so much dmg, while the devs proclaiming they dont design around that.
On that note other mmos got alot of gamebreaking problems when the tanks got too self-sufficient, as in they were more resistant AND had comparable output to dds. So i dont agree with @Kalise at all here for example. 99 % of the time the problem is always the tanks can do too much, not the opposite. Like its not 1999 anymore where tanks literarly just auto attack and get punched, in any mmo

There's a vast range both between and within each of "Trinity" and "Non-Trinity" designs, and codependence solely by specialization is not the only way to manipulate player behavior and frame balance around coordinated tasks, perspectives, and responsibilities.

And though it's a long read, I think you'll find that Kalise's position is quite far, if not antithetical, from wanting tanks to be able to excel in every output. No one thus far has asked that tanks be brain-dead. No one has asked, either, that they be more nearly omnipotent.

[Kaitoo]

There's a vast range both between and within each of "Trinity" and "Non-Trinity" designs, and codependence solely by specialization is not the only way to manipulate player behavior and frame balance around coordinated tasks, perspectives, and responsibilities.

And though it's a long read, I think you'll find that Kalise's position is quite far, if not antithetical, from wanting tanks to be able to excel in every output. No one thus far has asked that tanks be brain-dead. No one has asked, either, that they be more nearly omnipotent.

I read both of your posts, i was referring to this:
"Do you WANT people to play Tank ever? Because this is how you make no-one play Tanks ever. Give all of the power to DPS and make Tanks be useless little punching bags that can only do what Healers and DPS allow them to do." Which i am not seeing, hence me pointing it out. I didnt say he/she stated they should ne omnipotent, but the reality of tanks being too potent is much more realistic then they being punching bags iny any modern mmo. Thats like a fact of life.

As for holy trinity: There really isnt imo. Like it is a system closed in itself. You cant put external factors in if its about the codepency. Meaning if you alter the balance of a role, you gonna take or add it from an another role. Everything a tank, or any other role for that matter, does more you gonna subtract from other roles and vice versa. Another interesting point actually even if its a little bit offtopic: Because raids got more mechanically complex in the mmo genre (which has also its imprint on FFXIV) the role of healers got diminished. There were no "tankbusters" or similar mechanics in mmos, auto attack just really hit hard. So the healers had always something to do. Over time, more encounter involved more "skill" based mechanics where if played perfectly, the group could avoid almost all of the damage, making healer almost obsolete . The "solution" to this was unavoidable raid-wide damage that players take regardless of mechanics so the healer has something to do which we also have in FFXIV. Which is quite funny and silly to me.