What exactly IS a White Mage?

[Mansion]

I think they actually tend to get rid of elemental aspected damage / resistance. Magical / Physical is more than enough, if you want to play with buffs and debuffs.
There's more to that to be useful in a party : damage mitigation, damage down of enemy, damage up of party, vuln up as we said, party buff (any stat like crit, DH, haste), agro manipulation tools, mana regen...

Adding elemental buffs just moves the problem elsewhere, you break one meta to create another.

[Lyth]

I don't think that difficulty is the issue. For one, it's extremely subjective. If you read the forums and reddit at the start of this expansion, you'd think that WAR was the most difficult job ever created in an MMO. But that's just because they shouted the loudest.

Actually, it's less an issue of easy vs. difficult as it is straightforward vs. complex. If you wanted to make AST more complex, you'd have to explore ideas like making them using time to reverse damage à la Tracer. But that doesn't mean that the less weird jobs aren't entitled to their own identity.

The problem with a lot of the new systems in Stormblood is that they were added purely for the sake of introducing a job-specific gauge. It makes sense for something like WAR, which never really used MP to begin with. Sure, give them a gauge. Give NIN a gauge for tracking Huton. WHM has always had a gauge, even dating back to ARR. It's called an MP bar. Resource management is a thing they've always done. Lilies feel superfluous because they're there to be there.

Every job deserves to excel at least at one thing. On a job like WAR, for example, Fell Cleave is sacrosanct. You aren't allowed to out cleave Fell Cleave. There would be riots. You can't let a job deal out a better buff than Balance. You can't out trick Trick Attack. So what's WHM's schtick?

Ordinarily, I'd look at something like Benediction and say, there. Instant cast, max HP. It doesn't get better than that. But everyone and their dog has oGCD instant cast heals. I might look at regens and say, there. But SCH has Eos, which is the very best regen that ever was. And they have better shields. Why heal something when you can toss up a shield as a preemptive heal? It doesn't decay over time. You don't even have to be particularly clever about the timing. Sometimes, party-wide shields last most of the way through to the next boss jump, at which point you can just reapply them again.

What does WHM offer your group that no other job does? If you don't have a clear and immediate answer to the question, that's an identity problem. And chances are, it's because there are two or three extremely bloated jobs out there that are stifling everyone else's shot at having a unique identity.

[tinythinker]

I don't think that difficulty is the issue. For one, it's extremely subjective. If you read the forums and reddit at the start of this expansion, you'd think that WAR was the most difficult job ever created in an MMO. But that's just because they shouted the loudest.

Actually, it's less an issue of easy vs. difficult as it is straightforward vs. complex. If you wanted to make AST more complex, you'd have to explore ideas like making them using time to reverse damage à la Tracer. But that doesn't mean that the less weird jobs aren't entitled to their own identity.

The problem with a lot of the new systems in Stormblood is that they were added purely for the sake of introducing a job-specific gauge. It makes sense for something like WAR, which never really used MP to begin with. Sure, give them a gauge. Give NIN a gauge for tracking Huton. WHM has always had a gauge, even dating back to ARR. It's called an MP bar. Resource management is a thing they've always done. Lilies feel superfluous because they're there to be there.

Every job deserves to excel at least at one thing. On a job like WAR, for example, Fell Cleave is sacrosanct. You aren't allowed to out cleave Fell Cleave. There would be riots. You can't let a job deal out a better buff than Balance. You can't out trick Trick Attack. So what's WHM's schtick?

Ordinarily, I'd look at something like Benediction and say, there. Instant cast, max HP. It doesn't get better than that. But everyone and their dog has oGCD instant cast heals. I might look at regens and say, there. But SCH has Eos, which is the very best regen that ever was. And they have better shields. Why heal something when you can toss up a shield as a preemptive heal? It doesn't decay over time. You don't even have to be particularly clever about the timing. Sometimes, party-wide shields last most of the way through to the next boss jump, at which point you can just reapply them again.

What does WHM offer your group that no other job does? If you don't have a clear and immediate answer to the question, that's an identity problem. And chances are, it's because there are two or three extremely bloated jobs out there that are stifling everyone else's shot at having a unique identity.

It depends on how people define identity. A few examples:

1. Simple/Straightforward vs. Complex/Involved

2. Thematic elements/gimmicks

3. Unique abilities/effects

3a. Competitive contribution

If you just want a competitive contribution that sets a job apart, WHM could get a dps boost so that you want it for that reason at end-game. Or you could reduce straightforward healing speed/throughput for other healing jobs. Or alter/limit mana recovery options. Make SCH and AST more dependent on their gimmicks/job-specific resources to heal. That could work for SCH because it has Aetherflow stacks and pets that are directly involved in healing. Fiddle with shield strength or duration. Lessen potency of some abilities and boost others. Etc. Give a clear distinction with strenths and weaknesses. AST though has cards, which have no direct role in healing.

If you want a more clearly defined theme or gimmick, you would need to do something different with lilies or replace them with something else. Or dump lilies and let WHM have a mana battery crown with other healing jobs needing more careful mana management.

If you just want more things to do/manage, you need to find a way to use lilies or some other resource in more engaging ways.

I've seen replies referring to each of these in terms of discussing identity. Lots of ideas of what that should mean in terms of making WHM unique and desirable. I don't claim to have great ideas on what would make WHM better than it is now, but it's interesting to discuss and ponder. I like reading what people want to see.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

My own clumsy, off the top of my head sketch for some of this (if we are concerned with #s 1, 2, and 3 simultaneously)...

1. Add lililes earlier.

2. Give one or two buttons that rely on/consume lilies.

3. Focus on the theme of WHM in the game -- elemental/nature magic -- for designing a unique contribution (because SE isn't going to heavily prune AST and SCH healing and dps just to let WHM stand out).

How this premise plays out can go many ways. To offer a lackluster, unpolished example...

A. Add Fluid Aura II. An AoE bind spell to replace the single-target knockback and bind. To follow up on the elemental theme, have it give an ice/wind vuln debuff. I don't know or worry about what a particular part of the community considers meta, as that always shifts. Some change always recasts what jobs some people think they "have to take". But it would be a nice utility and dps buff. Now WHM has two AoE forms of crowd control (along with the Holy stun), which is something other healing jobs lack. Plus technically Repose I guess for another form of CC. Technically. Maybe that one could be an upgrade as well. Repose II... hmmmm...

B. Have lily consumption tied to the elemental/nature theme. Like "Aspect of Earth", "Aspect of Water", "Aspect of Wind". This could work in two ways: you have a button for each of those, and the number of lilies used up determines the strength of effects from or the duration of staying in a particular Aspect. All three buttons share a cool-down. Alternatively, you have one button and which Aspect you get is determined by how many lilies you use. One of the aspects requires a single lily, another requires two, the final one requires three.

In terms of what Aspects do, that's up in the air. Maybe one or more Aspects affect mobs cc'd by the WHM (leech health, extend duration of cc, etc.). Or something else entirely. So perhaps one Aspect adds an additional effect to cc'd mobs, another provides a group buff (something defensive, maybe), and so on.

C. Have another buff present by default whenever lilies are on the gauge. Maybe you throw Stone faster. Maybe you get a small % extra healing. Dunno. So you have to decide when to hold lilies and when to spend them as per B above.

That gives a unique gimmick and contribution and something to manage but is still not too complex.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

What does WHM offer your group that no other job does? If you don't have a clear and immediate answer to the question, that's an identity problem. And chances are, it's because there are two or three extremely bloated jobs out there that are stifling everyone else's shot at having a unique identity.

Hit the nail right on the head with this. WHM is lacking in something that is both unique and truly powerful. There is nothing the job has that the other healers can't replicate, it's an awful way to treat a job and I have no idea why people think it's ok.
I get that some people like the simplicity of the job, but that shouldn't mean that it isn't allowed to have an identity.

[Seraphor]

I like the aspect idea mention above.

Although i would treat it kinda like a bards song combined with AST sects.
Aspect of Water would increase the potency of HoTs.
Wind would increase potency of DoTs.
Earth would increase the effectiveness of...
Protect, make it a WHM exclusive again. Its so neglible as it is, but it could be WHMs USP. Stick it on a cooldown, have it only last a minute, and them WHM becomes the sustained, minor mitigator, instead of the superior situational mitigation of the other two.

[HyperiusUltima]

I like the aspect idea mention above.

Although i would treat it kinda like a bards song combined with AST sects.
Aspect of Water would increase the potency of HoTs.
Wind would increase potency of DoTs.
Earth would increase the effectiveness of...
Protect, make it a WHM exclusive again. Its so neglible as it is, but it could be WHMs USP. Stick it on a cooldown, have it only last a minute, and them WHM becomes the sustained, minor mitigator, instead of the superior situational mitigation of the other two.

Just remove Protect altogether. It’s nothing but a hindrance in high-end since all that content is circled around it. By making Protect WHM’s raid Cooldown early on for 10% mitigation(or 5% depending) there’s utility in that.

[Gemina]

I would put money on 5.0 protect in PvE finally getting this utility for WHM, or something similar to it. WHM needs both raid dmg mitigation and an increase to pDPS.

#makewhmgreatagain

[Johaandr]

Slowly dying?

sLoWlY DyING
Jeez no its a laid back playstyle compared to my main scholar lol.
Nothing wrong with it. People uses raid, «iT BriNgs NotHing tO thE tEam» excuses. It has frln assize!
Stop the wannabe meta talk n its not viable. That is bullshit and it proves people want to irmpove their dps nowdays and put it on fflogs and get blue logs instead what they expect they could get.
IMO playstyle should matter.

Let me like it the way it is stop being so stupidly bashfull over my single opinion.
Ik lily is unpopular but it has a cool consept lol they need to rework it.

[Exiled_Tonberry]

sLoWlY DyING
Jeez no its a laid back playstyle compared to my main scholar lol.
Nothing wrong with it. People uses raid, «iT BriNgs NotHing tO thE tEam» excuses. It has frln assize!
Stop the wannabe meta talk n its not viable. That is bullshit and it proves people want to irmpove their dps nowdays and put it on fflogs and get blue logs instead what they expect they could get.
IMO playstyle should matter.

Let me like it the way it is stop being so stupidly bashfull over my single opinion.
Ik lily is unpopular but it has a cool consept lol they need to rework it.

.....What?

[tinythinker]

.....What?

Three!

(is the answer three?)