SE, the concept of "Limited Jobs" is a really bad idea, turn back now

[Nabril]

Neither do you and I never stated that I was speaking for more than myself in that post.

Liar

"I've been saying for weeks now that jobs should be for everyone and that I want to see most players get the type of content they want but not at the cost of what others want. I think this type of content is possible without limited jobs"

This is you speaking against Blue Mage because you want the majority of the player base to get what they want. You're also implying here that Blue Mage is costing the majority of the player base something, but cleverly you have declined to say what that could possibly be.

[jon041065]

Some of this thread reminds me of summoner threads lol. I remember asking for some more grandiose primal specific actions and whenever I'd ask for it most (definitely not all) people would be like "you can't have 100% primal on screen its too big, it will break the game" / "yoshi-p said no!" / "impossible!".

At one point I literally quoted every post I made (which was like 50... >.>) to prove I never asked for 100% primal, because it was such a common response to me asking for something with a bit more bang (even though almost every post also included "I dont want to destroy the screen").

About a year for ahk morn reveal, and then a bit later demi-bahamut. :/ lol.

I want to be fair though and say there were some people asking for like "1000% primal", or others that thought it was unlikely but not entirely dismissive, but there was so much lumping to make one side look horrible, and on top of that this request, blue mage in duty finder state, will be a lot more work than adding sexy spells to summoner (so it's a big ask for sure).

That said I'd definitely say they take feedback into consideration and if we can show patience and reasonable feedback ("I want every single blue mage spell to be balanced for duty finder", that sounds exceptionally daunting ask - but most of us aren't asking that) - it could happen, with a lot of time lol.

It would take a lot of work and time so that's why I'm not expecting any changes till 6.0 IF there were to happen.

Are you happier with smn now? I haven't played it yet in Stormblood but did appreciate the changes it got for Heavensward.

[Nabril]

I never stated that I was speaking for more than myself in that post. During the past month, I've participated in this debate and have seen what the other people also in the debate say they want. There's been nothing yet to make me believe that limited jobs are necessary for the solo content that a lot have said they are interested in and there are others that agree with that. I never said "all players" because it's impossible to make everyone happy.

And what you said applies to you as well pal.

At no time in the history of this game has Square Enix been required to ask whether something is "necessary" before adding it in as a feature. Were relic weapons "necessary"? Was flying "necessary"? Was Eureka "necessary"? What the hell constitutes "necessary" in this game? It's a video game. Nothing in this game is "necessary". This has nothing to do with what is "necessary" because that term is completely baseless in a video game. You're just arguing against something that you personally don't like. I wish you'd be honest about that.

[Shougun]

It would take a lot of work and time so that's why I'm not expecting any changes till 6.0 IF there were to happen.

Are you happier with smn now? I haven't played it yet in Stormblood but did appreciate the changes it got for Heavensward.

Egi still look very sad (imo), but I've heard Yoshi say they haven't finished with their glamour egi system. Ahk Morn and Demi-Bahamut are amazing, definitely some serious highlights.

If there was a "why do you like playing summoner" list before it'd be just battle raise on DD and easy to manage mage (like bard), not too crazy about being stuck to the ground like black mage or dragoon lol. Now I'd say huge flare and bahamut, then battle raise. This is a big improvement in my mind. As I said I'd still like to see more primals in some way, if they could possible theme revive to phoenix primal for example, and things like that but I am feeling that summoner feels good now (which I /never/ felt with looking at the egi).

Tl;dr, yes. lol

Anyway didn't want to derail this thread, I was trying to respond to "they listen to feedback" with a story that related in some aspects. No more summoner talk! lol

I just want to say I have faith that SE can make advanced jobs (I'm going to keep pounding that drum "advanced job" thanks lol) rather than limited, and it'd be really cool. So I'd like to support that.

I really hope that the current version of Blue Mage is great, and I hope we can add to it - I don't want to see it scrapped. Mostly I join in threads just for that, I don't want to see SE just toss something out nor do I want to see this be all there is.

[jon041065]

I just want to say I have faith that SE can make advanced jobs (I'm going to keep pounding that drum "advanced job" thanks lol) rather than limited, and it'd be really cool. So I'd like to support that.

I really hope that the current version of Blue Mage is great, and I hope we can add to it - I don't want to see it scrapped. Mostly I join in threads just for that, I don't want to see SE just toss something out nor do I want to see this be all there is.

I agree with you 100% besides my faith in SE being a bit shaken.

Glad to hear you're enjoying smn more!

[ChocoFeru]

I'm still supporting the "limited jobs" idea and I hope it works.

They broke Summoner to fit him into raid content (he's just a warlock with dots and an ugly pet), so I don't want them to break BLU just to fit him into raid/dungeons.


Every job feels the same already. BLU will be something new, different and probably fun. We'll see.

[jon041065]

Liar

"I've been saying for weeks now that jobs should be for everyone and that I want to see most players get the type of content they want but not at the cost of what others want. I think this type of content is possible without limited jobs"

This is you speaking against Blue Mage because you want the majority of the player base to get what they want. You're also implying here that Blue Mage is costing the majority of the player base something, but cleverly you have declined to say what that could possibly be.

You need to read full posts and the discussion they are part of because you're distorting what I said.

I've never said that most players want the same thing I want in regard to blue. "I want to see most players get the type of content they want but not at the cost of what others want" is not just something specific to limited jobs. Whenever I've said that, I meant across the whole game. People want solo content and I'm on board with that. People want level sync and I fine either way because I don't see it as having a cost to anyone. I'm not for limited jobs because that is at the cost of people who wanted to main it. It would be nice if SE pushed what the trinity system in 14 is capable of or just moved past it but myself and others don't feel that limited jobs is the correct way to get there.

"Because you want the majority of the player base to get what they want" is this you implying that most are against limited jobs? I'd imagine that most players don't really care and will just play it till they are done with the Carnival and then wait till an update. That for them it won't really be content that keeps them subbing.

I can understand how Auryan believes that limited blu is a way of reaching the desired goal of a less restrictive trinity system that we both said we would like to see. To me, it's backwards but I can understand it so wouldn't be opposed to that method if SE told us that was what they are doing. The live letter didn't make it sound like that is what they are working towards but maybe there was not sufficient info since it sounded like a system for jobs to be in their own little box and not in the full game.

I'm still supporting the "limited jobs" idea and I hope it works.

They broke Summoner to fit him into raid content (he's just a warlock with dots and an ugly pet), so I don't want them to break BLU just to fit him into raid/dungeons.


Every job feels the same already. BLU will be something new, different and probably fun. We'll see.

What I said up above. There doesn't seem to be many that are against most of what you said here but just different view points on if limited jobs is the way to get there.

[Jandor]

Ah, okay, that's reasonable enough. I get what you mean now, and I can see where you're coming from, but that's kinda not the argument I was trying to put across - but thanks for being honest and straightforward, honestly.

<trim>

But again, thanks for the feedback, and appreciate it. Apologies also for being a bit of a dick. I see you're a fellow Cerberite, so if you see me running around Limsa pretending to be Willy Wonka and offering tours of my chocolate factory, consider your tour a free one. :3

Ok, that's fair. Apology accepted, and I for my part apologize for being a bit of a dick too.

I don't mind current BLU, or at least what we know of it, I just don't want solo stuff to be all there really is. I want to BLU it up in end-game content and I don't really see a reason why with a bit of work both Carnivale and a full job version of BLU can't exist side by side.

Edit: Given that BLU is capped at 50, and Stormblood jobs start at 50, it makes an easy jumping off point.

Initial BLU trainer gets you a job stone, you do your BLU leveling, unlock a lot of skills, unlock Carnivale, etc. and at level 50 a Mamool Ja who came over from the New World approaches you like "this charlatan doesn't know the full power of BLU, let me teach you" and you unlock a more traditional FFXIV job that levels up to cap and works in all content.

Could even have the two trainers play off each other, as SE raise the solo BLU cap the original guy comes back "this other guy is too set in his ways, my new path is the actual path to true BLU power."

Sort of like the original Arcanist split, but down 'unbalanced solo/properly balanced party' lines.

[Stigmar]

Again like I said until SE receive REAL FEEDBACK from after the job goes live they not really gonna pay much attention to these posts as they are just knee jerk reactions to news, once they receive feedback from player testing and at that point you still hate the idea of blu being solo class that's when you get to complain and just remember SE time frame to change anything that big is generally 4 years, queuing with a chocobo out and egi glamour for your references and I have to wonder would anyone care or would it upset the player base more that already got used to the way its been presented (like how you crazy kids think microtransactions are ok - which they aren't) again just wait and see cus Christmas is almost here!

[Powercow]

Again like I said until SE receive REAL FEEDBACK from after the job goes live they not really gonna pay much attention to these posts as they are just knee jerk reactions to news, once they receive feedback from player testing and at that point you still hate the idea of blu being solo class that's when you get to complain and just remember SE time frame to change anything that big is generally 4 years, queuing with a chocobo out and egi glamour for your references and I have to wonder would anyone care or would it upset the player base more that already got used to the way its been presented (like how you crazy kids think microtransactions are ok - which they aren't) again just wait and see cus Christmas is almost here!

So we should wait until Puppetmaster and Dancer are relegated to solo-only content before telling SE that they shouldn't do that. Gotcha. Thanks.

Your logic is hilariously backwards. It's precisely BECAUSE it takes SE an absurdly long time to do things that we should voice our concerns about BASE, CONCEPTUAL LIMITATIONS THAT WE DO KNOW ABOUT. Have you noticed most people aren't complaining about the Carnival's load screens taking too long, or that level 15-17 is kind of awkward to level because there's no good AoE skills, or that the dodo's conal sleep fart is glitchy? It's because none of that is playable at the moment. People are concerned with the idea of a job being relegated to years-old content only, not the nitty-gritty details of how the job does or does not function.

It'd be like if SE announced that Shadowbringers was going to remove all group content and be remade as a Battle Royale game with paid lootboxes and a 30-minute-max playtime before the game logs you off for the week. We don't need to play that to know it's a stupid idea.