Should one tank in tank stance?

[JustinHiryu]

I wish to get some opinions here. Should the main tank of an activity actually use a "tank stance" to tank? I have heard that it is alright to not only use tank stance to "tank", but to also remain in tank stance for the duration of the activity. On the flip side, I have also heard that a tank should only be in tank stance for a partial amount of the time of the activity. At times, I have also heard that a tank should not be in a "tank stance" at all no matter the activity or circumstance. Personally, I think that it is perfectly fine for a tank or main tank to be in "tank stance" for the duration of an activity. I have yet to be yelled at for doing so. I have been yelled at more for dropping "tank stance" when tanking and on rare occasions, I have been yelled at for not using more of my defensive abilities more often such as Blackest Night or cross-class abilities such as Rampart. So many people saying so many thing have gotten be a bit confused. So, I ask you good people here: Am I wrong in believing that it is alright for the main tank or only tank in an activity to remain in a "tank stance" for the duration? Is it wrong for said tank to be in a tank stance at all in an activity? Let me hear your thoughts. Thank you for your time.

[SeveralRats]

You should be using tank stances until you're playing at a point where you're trying to optimize your damage, at which point it's better to be in your DPS stance. That requires you to know the boss you're fighting and the damage it will do to you, when to use your defensive cooldowns for the best effect, having your healers being ready to keep you alive through that damage, and having your DPS managing their enmity properly so that you're able to hold aggro without being in a tank stance.

If you're just doing dungeons/normal mode boss fights, or aren't planning to push your damage to its limits, then tank stances are fine. They can make the fights go smoother than the DPS boost would if you don't know that the rest of your party will be doing their role optimally.

[JustinHiryu]

I see. Very insightful, indeed. Thank you for your time.

[Jd0064]

A tank in tank stance cannot complete the last 5 SSS dummies even in i390 gear, fact (Suzy / Alpha Savage 1-4)

While trash mob pulls in dungeons should be tank stanced so you can make big pulls easier almost no Boss (or sub boss) requires you to stay in tank stance after the opener. (Thats 8 seconds in Tank stance, maybe 10, rip pld)

From Sastasha to Praetorium, tank stance only makes tanking easier for tanks who doesnt know how to do mechanics or dodge aoes properly.

And while everyone will just say "Just Tank stance so you can easily clear " it doesnt mean Tank stance is a must during boss fights

A lot of people blame the tanks in dps stance in both Burn and Arboretum last bosses, but even then knowing when to use CDs makes all damage incoming negligable

[Canadane]

For dungeons, once sufficiently geared, you'd only need tank stance for large pulls. The individual bosses and other limited target fights such as primal fights, savage, etc. you'll only use your tank stance for initial enmity. The rest of the fight will be spent in your dps stance.
DRK and PLD can use their stance as an extra defensive cooldown if needed, though they rarely are.

You generally have two reasons people will be against this. Enmity and damage reduction.
Enmity is easy, everyone plays with it. This is why you pull in tank stance but swap out shortly after. Between diversion, lucid dreaming, and tactician/refresh, everyone has ways to reducing and lowering their enmity. Plus with Shirk, any tank swaps will only boost the MT's enmity further. It shouldn't be an issue.
Damage reduction is also easy. Nothing can one-shot you without suitable warning. Fights are heavily scripted, everyone will know when the tank busters happen. When a cooldown will be needed. Very rarely would you need a cooldown in addition to a tank stance. Ideally you'd never need it. The most dangerous thing to a tank in the game is big pulls in dungeons, and that's why I mentioned they're generally done in tank stance.

Of course, both of these assume everyone knows how to play decently enough. If someone makes a mistake you can't readily expect anything to work out very smoothly, no matter what role is at fault.

On a final thought, tanks that do everything in tank stance do a lot less than the 20% some people think they do. The slowdown to the kills are rather noticeable. I think the only worse thing to kill speed is a non-dpsing healer lol.
The benefits of using your dps stance is a lot more than just attacks dealing more damage. The abilities you can use in the stance, along with things being unable to kill you if they're dead first (or just phase changing), just make the entire fight easier.

[JustinHiryu]

Both JD and King, thank you for your insight.

[Delily]

I consider tank stances to be a tool. For all 3, they're useful when you're learning new content (or still gearing up) in order to provide you with some safety net, but once you've mastered the fight, you shouldn't really need beyond the initial enmity rotation. The only time this becomes a problem is on longer fights in PUG content where the DPS don't use their enmity dumps. Grit is also unique in that DRKs need it to use Blood Price, so it's essential to use on a packs. PLD and WARs don't have that restriction. With that in mind, tanks need to use their cool downs more. I've seen this as I level the healers. I've started telling tanks who are new they really should use Anticipation on cool down, as it will be available every other, if not every pack. I notice people tend to save the CDs for boss fights and tank busters, but there's more than enough tools to handle those in non savage content.

[PyurBlue]

You should start off in tank stance. If there is another tank, it will signal to them that you want to main tank and it will also make establishing aggro easier no matter the content. In dungeons most tanks will keep tank stance on for mob pulls and then switch to DPS stance for bosses after aggro is generated. For raids, use tank stance to establish an aggro lead with a couple of aggro combos, then switch to DPS. The damage reduction loss isn't a big deal in these cases and for PLD in particular, you gain much faster Oath gauge generation which gives you the ability to consistently Sheltron and increase defense.

Staying in tank stance for the duration of the content isn't optimal, but it's not terrible. I don't mind it unless I'm the main tank and the offtank is the one that keeps tank stance on.

For dungeons, once sufficiently geared, you'd only need tank stance for large pulls. The individual bosses and other limited target fights such as primal fights, savage, etc. you'll only use your tank stance for initial enmity. The rest of the fight will be spent in your dps stance.
DRK and PLD can use their stance as an extra defensive cooldown if needed, though they rarely are.

You generally have two reasons people will be against this. Enmity and damage reduction.
Enmity is easy, everyone plays with it. This is why you pull in tank stance but swap out shortly after. Between diversion, lucid dreaming, and tactician/refresh, everyone has ways to reducing and lowering their enmity. Plus with Shirk, any tank swaps will only boost the MT's enmity further. It shouldn't be an issue.

I'll just add to this that enmity controls have moderately long cooldowns. Unless the party is willing to stop and wait between pulls, they might not always be available. I tend to not use enmity reduction on mobs outside of the first pull because I'd rather not rip the boss off the tank. Everyone has to watch aggro, but I think the tank bears a little more responsibility outside of boss fights.

[Seraphor]

I consider tank stances to be a tool. For all 3, they're useful when you're learning new content (or still gearing up) in order to provide you with some safety net, but once you've mastered the fight, you shouldn't really need beyond the initial enmity rotation. The only time this becomes a problem is on longer fights in PUG content where the DPS don't use their enmity dumps. Grit is also unique in that DRKs need it to use Blood Price, so it's essential to use on a packs. PLD and WARs don't have that restriction. With that in mind, tanks need to use their cool downs more. I've seen this as I level the healers. I've started telling tanks who are new they really should use Anticipation on cool down, as it will be available every other, if not every pack. I notice people tend to save the CDs for boss fights and tank busters, but there's more than enough tools to handle those in non savage content.

Unfortunately theres not much space on xhotbars for all of the roles skills, and most tanks I know, or at least DRKs, choose Awareness over Anticipation.
In real terms, in the perfect situation, they each translate into a ~4% mitigation.
However, Parry is only valid against physical attacks, and Crit is checked before Parry (if you receive a critical hit, it can't be parried) so there's no point in using both at once.

In addition, WAR require Awareness for Raw Intuition (probably why they save it) and I believe PLDs base parry rate is lower to account for shield blocks, so Anticipation isn't as effective for them. (probably why they don't use it)

If you're playing with keyboard and mouse then sure, it's free mitigation, when it works.

[Seraphor]

I'll just add to this that enmity controls have moderately long cooldowns. Unless the party is willing to stop and wait between pulls, they might not always be available. I tend to not use enmity reduction on mobs outside of the first pull because I'd rather not rip the boss off the tank. Everyone has to watch aggro, but I think the tank bears a little more responsibility outside of boss fights.

The tank should have no issues holding enmity in a boss fight. So long as they start in tank stance and use a few enmity combos, with the odd top up, there should be no trouble whatsoever. There's nothing wrong with a tank doing this in most dungeons, their damage isn't a crucial factor like endgame raids.

Pulling mob packs however is quick, and depending on enemy placement you don't always have enough time to use all your enmity skills before they disperse and then you're playing a game of cat and mouse chasing them around. That's when you want your DPS to use their enmity cooldowns.