People who are mad about the "limited job" didn't actually want Blue Mage.

[Valdegarde]

White Mage's main shtick is healing comrades, not learning unbalanced moves from monsters.

The fact that you believe that's all Blue Mage and Blue Magic is makes me think you're the one that has a flawed idea of Blue Mage, not the people who are upset.

[SonKevin]

I don't understand the logic here.
People really want BLU but not as a solo job. It's as simple as that.

It's not as simple as that. People really just wanted RDM, but with a BLU aesthetic considering everyone is whining about the 'mini-game' aspect. They wanted another class that you gain skills through class quests (even though they largely removed that) and is basically a copy of RDM, but using enemy skills in their rotation instead of made up skills.

The fact that you believe that's all Blue Mage and Blue Magic is makes me think you're the one that has a flawed idea of Blue Mage, not the people who are upset.

So you're saying that learning skills from monsters and then using those skills isn't BLU's main shtick?

[Valdegarde]

And you're saying these skills are by nature unbalanced. The vast majority of Blue Mage skills aren't unbalanced whatsoever. Blue Mage is not defined by HOW they learn these enemy skills or HOW MANY they are or even WHAT they are. A Blue Mage is the end result of being able to interact with the game world in some way and use skills that other classes normally wouldn't be able to in their team.

A Blue Mage, is actually using these skills, on things in the game with the rest of the characters/jobs/classes, etc.

I highly doubt anyone who wanted to actually be a Blue Mage would consider the restrictions in place a necessary sacrifice to keep Blue Mage "pure".

[PortalScience]

BLU is rare. Blue Magic might not be as rare, but a dedicated BLU is rare. 6 didn't have a Blue Mage in NA release, 8 only had blue magic for a limit break, 9 ate the monsters and gained their skills. I can say that 10 had Ronso which can be close to BLU and the Tactics games had them all.

6 added it back in, and that brings the total games that had it to 9 main games (plus a whole bunch of mobile/etc).

You're right that you can't do a majority of the modern content. This is because they don't want to balance the class. They want this class to be unique in ways that they can't let other classes be unique. If they were to balance it out so that it's equal with all classes then it's not really worth it. Why would I spend hours trying to get a skill that will do nothing, but give me a normal attack. At that point they might as well drop it in favor of gaining skills at the end of a quest and by then you've got another class that is exactly the same as every other class in the game.

When you ask why would you spend hours to get the skill that does nothing... why do you play blue mage in those other games. The collection of skills that are mostly marginally useless is how the class has always been played. How often did you use Moon Flute in the original FFV? I unlocked it and never used it. Half the fun is finding them all, then picking the ones you like. Not every ability needs to be useful all the time (your main class is paladin, how often do you use Ultimatum?). BLU has MORE spells, which means you can pick and choose more. This is also why Death/Old/Flare/Graviga are all gated behind multiples, making them more rarely used. Why would you do that? Because it is fun to have it all, and to use it in the solo stuff. Remember that noone is saying end the solo option, we are saying, make it solo FOCUSED rather than solo ONLY. Not being able to use the class except for side-content is really disappointing. If SE had said "no matchmaking YET" and emphasized the YET instead of explaining it like it was permanent, people wouldn't be as upset.

The in-game precedent is a bad argument. They removed both of those examples because they were remnants of 1.0 and no longer made any sense. FFXIV 1.0 was unique in the way it shared certain skills that don't translate well to the current FFXIV. The last one was a literal glitch.

There are plenty more examples. I was picking them because the code would be easier to copy paste. In the current content, many CCs (Low Blow/Interject/Fluid Aura/Break/Sleep/Foot Graze) are often unusable on bosses. Some damage moves can't even be reduced by Passage of Arms.

[Fawkes]

I wanted Blue Mage to be like FFXI. I expected them to have lame scripted quests where you learn skills, because that would solve the problem of people not getting all their skills. Instead they chose to ignore the problem entirely by not letting Blue Mage be a real job. Blue Mage is NOT defined as being a broken overpowered solo job.

You could solve all the problems Yoshida mentioned in a number of ways that don't involve getting rid of the learning mechanic. We are getting a fake job because they don't want to have to do the work, end of story.

[Anselmet]

Honestly I don't see why they couldn't make a system so you COULD use the blue mage they had in mind. I know they say well a person can be kicked if you dont have x skill, well people get kicked for not being the right class. And even then, they could have made it so you were limited to a certain amount of skills if you were in a duty finder scenario. They could have had spells fill in certain roles to make a rotation or something rather. Or maybe a point system where big powerful spells would be limited and it could have encouraged unique builds.

[Malzian]

The problem with BLU is that this is not the implementation people wanted for it. Whenever it's asked for a job to be included in the game, they want it to be something that is playable in all the contexts that are available to any other job. They want it to be able to do the content in a truly meaningful way that is true to XIV and how it approaches its design.

The issue with this BLU implementation is that it doesn't even attempt to integrate in a meaningful way. This is not BLU for the sake of it being a part of the game, this is BLU for the sake of it being in the game so they can say it's there.

"You asked for BLU to be in the game, we gave it to you. Why are you complaining?"

[Kitfox]

So you're saying that learning skills from monsters and then using those skills isn't BLU's main shtick?

You can have that and not break group content. In the other thread you were literally saying that the skills have to be game breaking for it to be BLU. Don't move the goal posts.

You can have unique leveling, you can have learning system, you can have unique skill setup system, you can have solo content, but you can also have all of that without breaking group content. That's what people are upset about.

[Hacchan]

It kinda is that simple. Instead of making a gimmick out of getting skill, rendering the class in a sense 'worthless' content wise, as it'll unusable atm for anything; you can grab gameplay element from different class to make blue working.
You can use AST 'rng' system as some sort of base. In order to use/trigger monster attack, you start by pulling aether from the enemy and gaining stack of aether that either allow you to use a random monster attack with varying effect or something else. There's probably plenty of way to do it but what was announced for it doesn't really bode well. For now we can only wait and see how they are going to develop it and if it'll remain a gimmick that is restricted to a small fragment of the content.

[Fyce]

The problem with BLU is that this is not the implementation people wanted for it. Whenever it's asked for a job to be included in the game, they want it to be something that is playable in all the contexts that are available to any other job. They want it to be able to do the content in a truly meaningful way that is true to XIV and how it approaches its design.

The issue with this BLU implementation is that it doesn't even attempt to integrate in a meaningful way. This is not BLU for the sake of it being a part of the game, this is BLU for the sake of it being in the game so they can say it's there.

"You asked for BLU to be in the game, we gave it to you. Why are you complaining?"

Are you ignoring the fact that Yoshida called the shots for four years now, describing exactly how BLU would be done if it was implemented, and that people kept asking for it anyway?

Four years ago, when people were asking for BLU...
Yoshida: "BLU is interesting. But if we were to do it, it would have to be a solo class with specific content and would be unfit for regular party play."
Players: "Yeah, makes sense."

Today...
Yoshida: "Here, we made BLU. It's a solo class with specific content and is unfit for regular party play."
Players: "OMG WHAT I CANNOT BELIEVE IT HOW CAN THIS BE REEEEEEEEE!!!"