The whale mount is up on Mogstation

[Aster_E]

I hate shows of greed, and I have too chosen not to touch the cash shop ever again, as entertaining as the whale might be. However, I know how too many people will jump and buy new things as soon as new things come out, because restraint just isn't there. Any notion I might towards a boycott or people being more responsible with their money might as well be me talking to a cliff side.

[Sigma-Astra]

I hate shows of greed, and I have too chosen not to touch the cash shop ever again, as entertaining as the whale might be. However, I know how too many people will jump and buy new things as soon as new things come out, because restraint just isn't there. Any notion I might towards a boycott or people being more responsible with their money might as well be me talking to a cliff side.

It has nothing to do with restraint. If the person has the funds and wants to buy a $30 mount, you have no business to butt your nose into their financial affairs and say otherwise whether you disagree in personally spending that much or not.

It has nothing to do with being more responsible with their money at all until you hear stories of people spending $30 on the mount instead of $30 on a bill, gas, or food. Then, we can argue the idea of fiscal responsibility, but you literally have no reason or say to push your ideals on their personal spending habits if they have extra income to do so that literally harms no one but your own jealously about the issue.

[Vahlnir]

It has nothing to do with restraint. If the person has the funds and wants to buy a $30 mount, you have no business to butt your nose into their financial affairs and say otherwise whether you disagree in personally spending that much or not.

It has nothing to do with being more responsible with their money at all until you hear stories of people spending $30 on the mount instead of $30 on a bill, gas, or food. Then, we can argue the idea of fiscal responsibility, but you literally have no reason or say to push your ideals on their personal spending habits if they have extra income to do so that literally harms no one but your own jealously about the issue.

Correct. It's really no one's business telling others how to spend their money.

[Zojha]

Correct. It's really no one's business telling others how to spend their money.

More correctly:

If you want to dictate how the money of other people is spent, take it from them and spend it yourself. We call that "taxation". It's legal, if done by representatives of the common people. Not so much if it's done by the common people directly.

[Vahlnir]

More correctly:

If you want to dictate how the money of other people is spent, take it from them and spend it yourself. We call that "taxation". It's legal, if done by representatives of the common people. Not so much if it's done by the common people directly.

[Aster_E]

It has nothing to do with restraint. If the person has the funds and wants to buy a $30 mount, you have no business to butt your nose into their financial affairs and say otherwise whether you disagree in personally spending that much or not.

It has nothing to do with being more responsible with their money at all until you hear stories of people spending $30 on the mount instead of $30 on a bill, gas, or food. Then, we can argue the idea of fiscal responsibility, but you literally have no reason or say to push your ideals on their personal spending habits if they have extra income to do so that literally harms no one but your own jealously about the issue.

Way to miss the point of what I said.

You can buy something if you really, really want to buy it, as long as that thing is harmless. In the short run, buying one thing from a cash shop isn't going to do horrible, terrible things by any stretch, assuming you had the money you're right to spend (since it's yours). In the long run, it enables more of such sales to take place on top of the fees we already pay, and also on the back of systems in the game in need of more potential rewards (for example, the achievement certificates, which only have a couple items that weren't previously part of another system that was halted because it grew too big). To top that off, people are jumping on these new items as soon as they come out, because they're new. On the contrary to what you said, despite it somehow missing the point, that does scream "lack of restraint" on your part.

Furthermore, I did not say I want to dictate other peoples' expenditures. What I did say is that, if I were to suggest anything like a boycott or similar action, an action that would be taken up by we the consumers upon agreement with one another, would fall on deaf ears, and thus there would be no agreement, no action taken. The fact that you assume I want to come after your money or habits to keep you from making decisions tells me that you're being more defensive than you really need to be in this conversation. I don't think you intended that to be the case, but your words tell me this regardless.

So, really, I'm not attacking you for your decision to purchase a thing, just like I don't attack people who go out and buy so many packs of cigarettes or insane amounts of beer that doesn't even taste decent. I don't think it's a healthy practice, and I don't like businesses that take advantage of it because they know they can both get away with it and make more money in the process. You, however; you're fine. Don't take my disapproval of the cash shop as an attack on you.

I disagree. You jealous whiners who can't afford Mogstation stuff have no evidence that will happen.

Just having the money doesn't mean you have to buy a thing, and not buying a thing doesn't mean you don't have the money.

Those of us who DO have the money but choose not to blow it as soon as new things come out, however, do know this all too well in regards to business models. If a business model fails then it stops unless the owner is a dumbass bound, one day, to run for President that only other idiots would elect. If a business does something slimy and underhanded, but makes a ton of money off of it, then they are more like to keep going (eg., adding blatant cash shops to other fees already in place such as full subscriptions plus additional services, loot boxes to an extreme, etc.) until enough controversy picks up where the law has to step in. Then it becomes a definite problem, obviously. Right now? The cash shop is just greedy and I don't support it.

[Skivvy]

To top that off, people are jumping on these new items as soon as they come out, because they're new. On the contrary to what you said, despite it somehow missing the point, that does scream "lack of restraint" on your part.

So, really, I'm not attacking you for your decision to purchase a thing, just like I don't attack people who go out and buy so many packs of cigarettes or insane amounts of beer that doesn't even taste decent. I don't think it's a healthy practice, and I don't like businesses that take advantage of it because they know they can both get away with it and make more money in the process. You, however; you're fine. Don't take my disapproval of the cash shop as an attack on you.

Just having the money doesn't mean you have to buy a thing, and not buying a thing doesn't mean you don't have the money.

Ok, I'm curious - Why should people 'show restraint' when it comes to buying a new mount in a game? It's a bloody fluff item, and the cost is inconsequential for most people.

Also...comparing buying an in-game item to feeding one's addiction to cigarettes or alcohol? That's a bit of a stretch. Cigarettes and alcohol have proven negative health effects and can be highly addictive. Buying mounts and costumes generally doesn't threaten one's health. :P

I get it. I'm not a fan of the cash shop in a sub game either. I absolutely agree with you that SE is being greedy. They have gone full steam ahead with the amount of items they put in there as well as how much they charge. So by all means, bring complaints about the actual cash shop itself. However, SE has found a business practice that they're happy with, and I can't imagine it's going to change any time soon. With that said, there is no reason to start busting out the insults to those that actually buy items. This is a bloody game. It's meant to be enjoyed, and that translates into different ways for every single person that plays.

[Sigma-Astra]

Way to miss the point of what I said.

You can buy something if you really, really want to buy it, as long as that thing is harmless. In the short run, buying one thing from a cash shop isn't going to do horrible, terrible things by any stretch, assuming you had the money you're right to spend (since it's yours). In the long run, it enables more of such sales to take place on top of the fees we already pay, and also on the back of systems in the game in need of more potential rewards (for example, the achievement certificates, which only have a couple items that weren't previously part of another system that was halted because it grew too big). To top that off, people are jumping on these new items as soon as they come out, because they're new. On the contrary to what you said, despite it somehow missing the point, that does scream "lack of restraint" on your part.

Furthermore, I did not say I want to dictate other peoples' expenditures. What I did say is that, if I were to suggest anything like a boycott or similar action, an action that would be taken up by we the consumers upon agreement with one another, would fall on deaf ears, and thus there would be no agreement, no action taken. The fact that you assume I want to come after your money or habits to keep you from making decisions tells me that you're being more defensive than you really need to be in this conversation. I don't think you intended that to be the case, but your words tell me this regardless.

So, really, I'm not attacking you for your decision to purchase a thing, just like I don't attack people who go out and buy so many packs of cigarettes or insane amounts of beer that doesn't even taste decent. I don't think it's a healthy practice, and I don't like businesses that take advantage of it because they know they can both get away with it and make more money in the process. You, however; you're fine. Don't take my disapproval of the cash shop as an attack on you.

I didn't miss the point and I'm not taking it as a direct attack either like you think I am. Everything I've said is technically correct and no matter how you try and spin the idea, it still and factually is, literally none of your business in what others do nor does it harm you personally or impact you in any way whether someone buys the whale mount or does not. Literally, it does not affect you in any way and the only reason it does is because you're the one taking the act of buying it personally.

If a person really wants something and they have the means to buy it on the first day, it does not mean there's a lack of restraint. If that were the case then you'd have to argue that anyone who puts in pre-orders for collector editions have "restraint" problems or those who spend money on 2-day shipping because they couldn't wait the additional extra days for free shipping.

Again, this is a silly thing to disapprove the community of since it's literally no one's business what someone else does with their own money and placing the sole fault and ire into the people who want the whale is incorrect and wrong.

[Aster_E]

Ok, I'm curious - Why should people 'show restraint' when it comes to buying a new mount in a game? It's a bloody fluff item, and the cost is inconsequential for most people.

The same two reasons restraint is good for a lot of items, both in-game and in real life. It tells the merchants and person(s) developing the item that, in some possibility, the pricetag is too high for what is being offered, even if people could afford it (imagine some major brand or company charging $50-60 on a hammer worth 20-30 tops. It reins in those prices a little. Second, and far more importantly, to prevent budget crisis or buyer's remorse. Either emergencies happen that require your money, or something better comes along that you want but suddenly don't have quite enough spare cash lying around; or maybe you do have enough but you kick yourself because you find yourself not getting anywhere near as much enjoyment out of a thing as what you hoped for. Absolutely this case does not apply to everyone, but budgets are a thing, and so is buyer's remorse. Give a new thing time, and ask yourself first if you really want it, as well make sure you have no problem spending that money. That's not an order but advice.

Also...comparing buying an in-game item to feeding one's addiction to cigarettes or alcohol? That's a bit of a stretch. Cigarettes and alcohol have proven negative health effects and can be highly addictive. Buying mounts and costumes generally doesn't threaten one's health. :P

When you look at it that way, yes, you're right. It would be a stretch to compare optional gaming fluff to potentially dangerous substance. However, that wasn't the angle I was going for. I was looking more at companies selling what they will because they can, and people buying into it regardless of how good or bad it is. In the case of optional gaming fluff, it's not dangerous to your health, but a lack of restraint can lead to falling short on cash down the line should you need it for an emergency, or for something you actually do want more than the fluff, because of budgeting (again only potentially). One time doesn't hurt. Then again, when does SE stop at one time with their fluff?

So really, I'm not saying "don't ever" when I bring up restraint. I'm saying "have care, and wait a bit."

I didn't miss the point and I'm not taking it as a direct attack either like you think I am. Everything I've said is technically correct and no matter how you try and spin the idea, it still and factually is, literally none of your business in what others do nor does it harm you personally or impact you in any way whether someone buys the whale mount or does not. Literally, it does not affect you in any way and the only reason it does is because you're the one taking the act of buying it personally.

If a person really wants something and they have the means to buy it on the first day, it does not mean there's a lack of restraint. If that were the case then you'd have to argue that anyone who puts in pre-orders for collector editions have "restraint" problems or those who spend money on 2-day shipping because they couldn't wait the additional extra days for free shipping.

Again, this is a silly thing to disapprove the community of since it's literally no one's business what someone else does with their own money and placing the sole fault and ire into the people who want the whale is incorrect and wrong.

Yeah, you're definitely missing the point if you're saying "this is a silly thing to disapprove the community," or think I'm butting into YOUR business making YOUR decision of what to buy. You're being overly defensive when I'm already saying do what you will. My disapproval is with the shop itself, not with you. It would take a lack of business for things to change, but I am not trying to impose upon you that you shouldn't buy. I'm not telling you to stop or otherwise butting into your own choices. On the other hand, you are proving precisely what I said at the end of a previous message, where even bringing up the idea would be the same or worse off compared to just talking to a wall. I brought up my points, said that I'm taking my own action without expecting it of anyone else, and you're sitting there going nuts over it, arguing against me on it as though I was demanding change, when I in no way told you that you have to follow my points or ideas.

So, I'll tell you what. If you don't want other people inside your business or what you do with yourself, then I am going to make one suggestion to you - just one. Don't go after people for sharing an opinion that you don't like. All you're doing is saying that the opinion somehow affects you. If you don't care for my opinion, then pretend that I haven't said a single thing. Pretend that I'm not even here. Then you won't have to keep responding to me with this asinine argument we're having. Because, and I will say this one last time to you: I am not out to change your mind, your habits, or your decisions when it comes to buying from the Magstation, and my own decision not to give SE more of my money has nothing to do with you.

[Sigma-Astra]

Yeah, you're definitely missing the point if you're saying "this is a silly thing to disapprove the community," or think I'm butting into YOUR business making YOUR decision of what to buy. You're being overly defensive when I'm already saying do what you will. My disapproval is with the shop itself, not with you. It would take a lack of business for things to change, but I am not trying to impose upon you that you shouldn't buy. I'm not telling you to stop or otherwise butting into your own choices. On the other hand, you are proving precisely what I said at the end of a previous message, where even bringing up the idea would be the same or worse off compared to just talking to a wall. I brought up my points, said that I'm taking my own action without expecting it of anyone else, and you're sitting there going nuts over it, arguing against me on it as though I was demanding change, when I in no way told you that you have to follow my points or ideas.

So, I'll tell you what. If you don't want other people inside your business or what you do with yourself, then I am going to make one suggestion to you - just one. Don't go after people for sharing an opinion that you don't like. All you're doing is saying that the opinion somehow affects you. If you don't care for my opinion, then pretend that I haven't said a single thing. Pretend that I'm not even here. Then you won't have to keep responding to me with this asinine argument we're having. Because, and I will say this one last time to you: I am not out to change your mind, your habits, or your decisions when it comes to buying from the Magstation, and my own decision not to give SE more of my money has nothing to do with you.

I never said that you were butting into my business, I never even talked about buying the whale myself. I was speaking in the general context of people buying them. I think you're the one taking everything personal and being hyper defensive here, while also assuming that I'm talking about myself.

If anyone is missing the point, it's you right now. You keep making something general in speaking a personal affair, strawmanning things I never even clarified in the first place that I had done myself in order to make a point. Why? Point me in the direction where I said that you were butting into MY business or that I bought the whale.

Please, if you can show me where I explicitly said that then maybe you'd have a point. Otherwise, this is a lot of hot air and overthinking into things I never even specified in the first place when I was speaking generally.

You seem personally bothered that I told you to stay out of other people's business. Not MY business, but others.

Don't go after people for sharing an opinion that you don't like. All you're doing is saying that the opinion somehow affects you. If you don't care for my opinion, then pretend that I haven't said a single thing. Pretend that I'm not even here. Then you won't have to keep responding to me with this asinine argument we're having.

Maybe start taking your own advice if you're not going to read what people write either regarding their own opinions and instead making up your own assumptions of what they were writing for the benefit of your own point.

You literally did not read or at least understand that I was speaking generally in every single one of my posts towards you and that it had nothing to do with myself personally, but your stance against what a bunch of nameless others do with their money.