New roles for existing jobs idea

[Paladinleeds]

Not only have the developers gone on record saying it isn't happening, I also believe they've said they're looking to split off SMN and SCH into separate ones (perhaps have SCH be a job that you pick up at level 30, but works like the new expansion jobs that you can be any level 30 to get it?), such that they no longer have the base Arcanist class. Could be wrong on that particular part though.

[Mimilu]

Not only have the developers gone on record saying it isn't happening, I also believe they've said they're looking to split off SMN and SCH into separate ones (perhaps have SCH be a job that you pick up at level 30, but works like the new expansion jobs that you can be any level 30 to get it?), such that they no longer have the base Arcanist class. Could be wrong on that particular part though.

They've been saying that since ARR. >w>

[DeaconMoore]

Not only have the developers gone on record saying it isn't happening, I also believe they've said they're looking to split off SMN and SCH into separate ones (perhaps have SCH be a job that you pick up at level 30, but works like the new expansion jobs that you can be any level 30 to get it?), such that they no longer have the base Arcanist class. Could be wrong on that particular part though.

Hmm, kinda baffling to me. I mean, is it really so hard to say hey you got a scholar stone equipped, miasma does X; hey you have a summoner stone equipped, miasma does Y; hey you don't have a soul stone equipped miasma does Z? I mean, they do manage to change our classes up in pvp...

Is the spaghetti code that is the core of FFXIV so tangled up they can't?

[Iscah]

Hmm, kinda baffling to me. I mean, is it really so hard to say hey you got a scholar stone equipped, miasma does X; hey you have a summoner stone equipped, miasma does Y; hey you don't have a soul stone equipped miasma does Z? I mean, they do manage to change our classes up in pvp...

Is the spaghetti code that is the core of FFXIV so tangled up they can't?

I think Miasma can be switched out for something else (as with scholar eventually swapping Ruin for Broil) but the effect of Miasma cannot be changed.

[HyoMinPark]

I think Miasma can be switched out for something else (as with scholar eventually swapping Ruin for Broil) but the effect of Miasma cannot be changed.

I don’t know. I’d think they could change these values—after all, they’ve already done something similar with SMN Miasma versus SCH Miasma: one scales its potency off of INT, the other off of MND. So I do think it’s possible, what DeaconMoore is suggesting. I think it’s more the question of “Do they want to do this” as opposed to “Can they do this”.

[Vaer]

Hmm, kinda baffling to me. I mean, is it really so hard to say hey you got a scholar stone equipped, miasma does X; hey you have a summoner stone equipped, miasma does Y; hey you don't have a soul stone equipped miasma does Z? I mean, they do manage to change our classes up in pvp...

Is the spaghetti code that is the core of FFXIV so tangled up they can't?

They've basically done this in SB. SMN has versions of the spell that replace the default ones that SCH/ACN and SMN below 66ish has access to (Miasma/Bio II > III), so they can separately balance them without affecting the other job and even Arcanist at lower levels.

Branching assumes they share certain skills, so they'd have to replace them somehow to not affect the other jobs if they change one of them. They could just make a new ability (like what they did with Ruin>Broil, or Ruin>Ruin III and Bio/Miasma) but if you're going to do that might as well make it a new job since they basically aren't really branching much after that.

I'm not sure why they don't just scale it based on stone equipped, but I guess they would rather add new abilities that are easier to debug or change a potency number that affects one job.

I do find it odd that Summon/Summon II seems to have this functionality since it summons different pets depending on your stone.

[Shurrikhan]

Hmm, kinda baffling to me. I mean, is it really so hard to say hey you got a scholar stone equipped, miasma does X; hey you have a summoner stone equipped, miasma does Y; hey you don't have a soul stone equipped miasma does Z? I mean, they do manage to change our classes up in pvp...

Is the spaghetti code that is the core of FFXIV so tangled up they can't?

They also went on record saying content was cut from ARR because they had to completely rework the 1.x code, and yet that same code keeps being an alleged restriction to this day...

Having SMN and SCH nominally sourced by the same class means, in itself, absolutely nothing beyond a lore attachment. It could entail that they level together, or it could entail zero connection in leveling. It could entail that they each require Arcanist level 30, and then Arcanist goes no further, matches the higher of the separately leveled SMN / SCH, or remains as a third suboption. Without the system, the connection is no more than flavor text, and every issue that has spawned from the SMN / SCH connection has been due to implementation through that system, not the fact alone that the two share some lore or a base-class origin.

Already even pre-30 traits are adjusted retroactively when equipping the SCH / SMN job stones, while certain pre-30 spells go/went missing upon equipping the stone. An aura filter could as easily make every remaining shared skill act completely differently between the two jobs if the devs felt that was beneficial. And yet, even after making it so the system is a non-issue aside from shared experience, they do nothing to remedy the so-called tenuous situation. So, I have to wonder, is it really as problematic as alleged? Conceptually, it's certainly not. And while it proved a minor debacle originally, that was only due to how poorly the connection was made between the two jobs (i.e. due the systems created uniquely, and poorly, for that connection).