Is it weird that I like Zenos as a villain?

[Edax]

Does every single story need to have the villain to set on their arse in their Dr.Claw esque chair cackling maniacally until the hero comes knocking at their door?

By that point the villain may as well be Bowser and once you reach that point the story's villain would either end up one of two things:He'd need some intruiging plot behind them or be a comic relief no different than the likes of Bowser and Dr.Wily

Again all of this is just my personal opinion not objective stuff.

Was it too much ask for an intriguing plot? It was interesting for me uncovering the history of Lady Iceheart and her Heretics. There was nothing to Zenos beyond the first impression.

[MetalSnakeXI1]

Was it too much ask for an intriguing plot? It was interesting for me uncovering the history of Lady Iceheart and her Heretics.

The story of Zenos hasn't wrapped up yet if you didn't notice,he still lives(spoiler alert for patch 4.4) and we haven't even seen the very last MSQ patch for stormblood just yet to give a full judgement.Heck for all we know Zenos could very well make it to 5.0

And Ysayle/Iceheart wasn't really a villain compared to Thordan and Nidhogg(btw I like Nidhogg more than both Zenos and Gaius personally but that's for another time).She's more comparable to Avalanche(the "terrorist" group of FF7 that Cloud,Tifa and Barret are part of) where she isn't really in the wrong but her means were questionable....again much like Avalanche

[Edax]

The story of Zenos hasn't wrapped up yet if you didn't notice,he still lives(spoiler alert for patch 4.4) and we haven't even seen the very last MSQ patch for stormblood just yet to give a full judgement.Heck for all we know Zenos could very well make it to 5.0

And Ysayle/Iceheart wasn't really a villain compared to Thordan and Nidhogg(btw I like Nidhogg more than both Zenos and Gaius personally but that's for another time).She's more comparable to Avalanche(the "terrorist" group of FF7 that Cloud,Tifa and Barret are part of) where she isn't really in the wrong but her means were questionable....again much like Avalanche

What? I thought the story made it clear Zenos was dead? That its just his meat being used? For all intents and purposes, the Ascian that is possessing him has become the new villian, whomever he or she is.

[MetalSnakeXI1]

What? I thought the story made it clear Zenos was dead? That its just his meat being used? For all intents and purposes, the Ascian that is possessing him has become the new villian, whomever he or she is.

(SPOILER ALERT again for both previous and current patches)


Remember the sahagin priest from ARR and how he used the echo to possess different bodies similar to what the Ascians do?

Well Zenos used the Resonant(a power that is pretty much the same as the echo) to send his soul to a different body.....that of an Elezen who was a part of the Ala Mhigan resistance.

That elezen appeared in a cutscene inside the Magitek research facility in Gyr Abania where he killed a resistance member,stole a garlean magitek vehicle and mentioned that "the hunt" must continue......using the same sword zenos used and displaying the same power zenos used.

Also the ascian possessing Zenos's body is named Elidibus and he's a male ascian that's been in the game since ARR........remember?

[Edax]

(SPOILER ALERT again for both previous and current patches)


Remember the sahagin priest from ARR and how he used the echo to possess different bodies similar to what the Ascians do?

Well Zenos used the Resonant(a power that is pretty much the same as the echo) to send his soul to a different body.....that of an Elezen who was a part of the Ala Mhigan resistance.

That elezen appeared in a cutscene inside the Magitek research facility in Gyr Abania where he killed a resistance member,stole a garlean magitek vehicle and mentioned that "the hunt" must continue......using the same sword zenos used and displaying the same power zenos used.

Also the ascian possessing Zenos's body is named Elidibus and he's a male ascian that's been in the game since ARR........remember?

No. And Zenos was just picking up random weapons off the ground to use, so that doesn't even match up what that random Elezen using Zeno's katana. So that's implying that Elezen is somebody else since Zeno's defining trait was that he wasn't attached to any of his weapons.

[MetalSnakeXI1]

No. And Zenos was just picking up random weapons off the ground to use, so that doesn't even match up what that random Elezen using Zeno's katana. So that's implying that Elezen is somebody else since Zeno's defining trait was that he wasn't attached to any of his weapons.

Well when you're in a new body why not find the weapon that's been bathed in your power than just picking any random sword so at that time he didn't have much of a choice.

And even without the sword thing the game made it so obvious it's Zenos possessing his body,from the obvious background music to the mention of "The Hunt".....something only Zenos cared about and rarely any of his followers(even his devout nutjob worshipper Asahi) talk about.

As for the "No".....did you buy scenario skips to get to Stormblood?Cuz Elidibus isn't a new character at all.

He's been there since the days of A Realm Reborn where he met Minfillia and the Warrior of Light for the first time,played a big role in Heavensward where he brought in the Warriors of Darkness and cooperated with Urianger,and recently in Stormblood is assisting Emperor Varis using Zenos's body to establish Varis's authority over Garlemald to undermine the influence of the Populares,a group of Garleans that opposes the way the royal family's been running the empire with.

If anything he's the most active ascian out of the entire group beside Lahabrea who got offed by Thordan in Heavensward

[Edax]

Well when you're in a new body why not find the weapon that's been bathed in your power than just picking any random sword so at that time he didn't have much of a choice.

And even without the sword thing the game made it so obvious it's Zenos possessing his body,from the obvious background music to the mention of "The Hunt".....something only Zenos cared about and rarely any of his followers(even his devout nutjob worshipper Asahi) talk about.

As for the "No".....did you buy scenario skips to get to Stormblood?Cuz Elidibus isn't a new character at all.

He's been there since the days of A Realm Reborn where he met Minfillia and the Warrior of Light for the first time,played a big role in Heavensward where he brought in the Warriors of Darkness and cooperated with Urianger,and recently in Stormblood is assisting Emperor Varis using Zenos's body to establish Varis's authority over Garlemald to undermine the influence of the Populares,a group of Garleans that opposes the way the royal family's been running the empire with.

If anything he's the most active ascian out of the entire group beside Lahabrea who got offed by Thordan in Heavensward

No, I didn't scenario skip. Nor did I say Elidibus was a new character. Nothing I have said implied that. Last I remember, White Robe was chatting on the moon with a useless character.

[Alleo]

No. And Zenos was just picking up random weapons off the ground to use, so that doesn't even match up what that random Elezen using Zeno's katana. So that's implying that Elezen is somebody else since Zeno's defining trait was that he wasn't attached to any of his weapons.

Yet somehow he still always used Katana. We have it not 100% confirmed as true but his talk, the way he attacks, the comment about dieing but not feeling like going for redemption and the talk about the hunt and his knowledge about Garlean technology makes it quite clear that its probably him.

About fighting alone or in a group, here are some quotes out of the lore book:

Garuda: "[..] the trio emarked upon their journey to confront Garuda." "Amidst the whirling winds the adventurer suceeded in striking down the Lady of the Vortex, only to see her rise once more [...]"

Rhitahtyn sas Arvina: "The adventurer then led a small unit into the innermost sector, and at the end of a fierce struggle, dealt [..] his death-blow"

Castrum Meridianum: "[...] the selfsame adventurer [...] once more took charge of an elite adventurer unit." "[...] Cid nan Garlond delivered the adventurer and his comrades to the stage of the final confrontation with Gaisu [...]"

Ultima Weapon: " [...] the adventurer was spared death and as the fires raged all about, he laid low both Gaius and his Ultima Weapon." (seemingly the rest has died)

Ramuh: "[...] the Lord of Levin elected to suspend judgement until the Warrior of Light himself underwent a trial by combat. Thus was he forced to strike down Ramuh [...]"

Against Nabriales: "He then tore open a dimensional rift [...] and the Warrior of Light followed. In that otherwordly void the adventurer defeated his Ascian foe and rescued Minfilia, returning all three to the Rising Stones."

The steps of Faith: "[...] that the Scions make every effort to assemble a contingent of elite adventurers - a volunteer force under the leadership of the Warrior of Light."

King Thordan: "Judgement passed the self-proclaimed god-king duly turned to leave, but not before issuing the Warrior of Light a challenge. [...] he would need to strike him and his knights down. How the Warrior of LIght managed to overcome such impossible odds that day, none can say."

This are only small examples but the lore book makes it quite clear when we are alone and when we have other adventurers with us. As far as I can see we only had them with us at the end of 2.0 against Garlemald and at the steps of faith (where we searched for adventurers even ingame). Every single primae was done solo according to lore book and some even wonder how he for example manages to slay Thordan and his knights alone. That way the story also makes sense because we simply had no time to get adventurers in most of the scenes. So for me it makes sense that ingame all the talk about having comrades is mostly just a hint for us to gather people and maybe an ingame joke about this.

About the topic: I am fine with villians like Zenos because people like him do exist in the real life too and not everyone needs some bad past to have reasons to be a certain way. I am just a bit sad that his story did not end after the fight, because I am not really sure how he can still be interesting to the story itself and I dont want someone that constantly tries to fight us either.

[Iscah]

(SPOILER ALERT again for both previous and current patches)


Remember the sahagin priest from ARR and how he used the echo to possess different bodies similar to what the Ascians do?

Well Zenos used the Resonant(a power that is pretty much the same as the echo) to send his soul to a different body.....that of an Elezen who was a part of the Ala Mhigan resistance.

That elezen appeared in a cutscene inside the Magitek research facility in Gyr Abania where he killed a resistance member,stole a garlean magitek vehicle and mentioned that "the hunt" must continue......using the same sword zenos used and displaying the same power zenos used.

We've *assumed* it's the Resonance that allowed Zenos to do that.... but can't be 100% sure. (I've seen an alternate theory that it might be something to do with the sword - which seemed to initially get pointed out as 'something special' but that's never come up again... so perhaps some chance of an ancient relic being able to harbour a soul until the next unfortunate person comes along and picks it up. Compare the lore surrounding the primal Odin, which suggests the primal actually resides in the sword while the armoured rider is a tempered mortal.)


In any case, the "katana-wielding soldier" is certainly intended to be Zenos, and there are several cues.

- his choice of weapon (whether it's the exact same sword or not)

- his reference to "the hunt"

- speaking in theatrical metaphors - Zenos also did this in the scene at Ala Mhigo just before he killed himself. Possibly earlier too - would not be surprised it it's a running feature of his dialogue I didn't notice at the time. I will pay more attention when I get to replaying Stormblood!

- saying he has "lost many things, but his mind is still his own" - implying that his body is not.

- just before flying off, he smirks - and it's very much Zenos's expression on a different face.

[Dirwen]

Zenos reminds me of Sephiroth except for the mother issues so it is kinda boring but then I didn't really enjoy the storyline in FF14. I enjoyed the storyline in FF11 more.