How Blue Mage Could Exist in FFXIV

[GDofLevin]

Hi you may not know me but I know you. I read that like myself you were offering plans for implementing Blue Mage into FFXIV. I have been on a similar quest of late and was wondering if you'd be interested in looking over and honestly and without bias critique my own rendition of the class and take on it. If you like it please leave a comment or such. I would greatly appreciate it also if you'd lend me my support on my Tumblr as well as introduce me to your own comrades and fans of the concept.

Picture and History: https://tf-lover.deviantart.com/art/...tory-705876064

Tumblr: https://serpro25-blog.tumblr.com/

[Starcake28]

Ya leave blue mage like FF11 u don't need to get hit to learn a spell also it don't take tht long to learn spells just some ppl in game wasn't doing it right so thy took weeks but me i took 14secs for some 5 secs for some but sorry for everyone tht Didn't know tht as for BLU tank HELL NO tanking is out the Question if thy did do tht every player tht love BLU will be piss off leave it dps which i found out from a friend thy not making a tank as a mage class because BLU is mostly mana dps so thy don't really need a weapon so be looking for a all spell class if thy stay with it

[Bright-Flower]

There are two ways I can think of.

A. Have blue mages as mages that study the way monsters utilize aether naturally and train to replicate the process.

B. 'Cerulean mage' approach where it's a magitek thing.

Personally I'd rather get a pure blue mage down the road but I could maybe see them adapting blue mage into a magitek tank of sorts though I'd rather get a magitek job separate from blue mage.

[PangTong]

Reposting my reply to another thread:

The issue I see with Blue Mage is this: The entire concept of the job is about learning new skills. In a single player game where you gradually learn skills over the course of the story and then complete the game, this system works fine. However in an MMO like XIV where most of the active users and content is at endgame, with a very fixed set of final skills for each job, this presents a problem. Even if you go out of your way to design a special skill-acquisition system specifically for Blue Mage, eventually they are going to get all their necessary skills and have nothing left to learn (until the next expansion). So then, what distinguishes them from any other job in endgame content? What is their unique defining trait, once learning monster skills is over?

My idea is that "learning" skills should somehow be incorporated into their rotation. Let's say Blue Mage has a few "generic" skills, a single-target attack, an aoe attack, and a buff or support skill. Under normal circumstances, these skills are quite weak and just use the BLU's normal weapon. However BLU also comes equipped with a special "Learn" trait or ability, where by taking damage from an enemy or using an ability on them, these basic skills are transformed into new, special ones based on the monster that the BLU is fighting.

Enemies would be divided into a few broad categories, such as Humanoid, Beast, Mechanical, Voidsent, Elemental, etc. When "Learn" is used with an enemy of one of these categories, the basic skills become special monster skills based on that category. If you use Learn on a mechanical creature, then your basic attack becomes Rocket Punch, your aoe attack becomes Missile Launcher, or Flamethrower. You get free use of these new abilities for a period of time (a minute or two, probably) , and then you need to "Learn" again to either get them back or pick a different type of enemy. Each of these attacks in each category would have slightly different functionalities, meaning BLU's rotation and overall party utility could change depending on what type of creature was being fought, which I think would be super interesting.

This would be in conjunction with an array of standard BLU spells that they always have access to and learn while leveling. Stuff like Goblin Punch or White Wind you'd just get through job quests or whatever and always have access to, to some extent.

The popular idea of a Blue Mage which goes around learning dozens of different skills and then swapping them in and out depending on what they're doing like in XI is unrealistic, in my opinion. It's not even particularly faithful to Blue Mages in the rest of the Final Fantasy series, who learn from only a relatively short list of monster skills and don't do any kind of ability loadout configuration.

[Bright-Flower]

I don't see that working out in a game with FF XIV's structure. Having blue mage's abilities react different say depending on if you're fighting Omega, Midgarsormr or Zenos could lead to the job becoming too complicated, too inconsistent to be used reliably in raid progression, or homogenizing them too much and making the system all flash no substance. A mechanic where they get hit and trigger some sort of ability may work, kind of like shield, but I don't see that functioning as more than a basic counter, and would only really work if they were made tanks.

You're right though that you can't really be consistently learning new abiltieis. They could incorporate learning abilities into the job story, but you won't be learning them throughout the expansion. And really, random outdoor mobs and even bosses don't really have abilities you could just give to players. Most normal enemies just have different shapes of generic aoe attacks to deal with. And special boss abilities wouldn't exactly translate well directly to a player. These can work fine in turn based games but not so much in ff xiv.

So I think really the best they could do is to keep the theme in tact. Have the lore be that they learn moves by studying monsters, and have their abilities themed after classic blue mage spells. But like so many other jobs, blue mage is going to need to see significant change to fit into the ARR onward mold. Summoner's the standout example though it got a bit closer with demi bahamut. But black mage also changed a lot, particularly with fire/blizard/lightning serving different purposes in the rotation rather than being the same spell with a different element and animation. DRK shed the sacrificing hp for damage aspect and became a tank. Ultimately, traditional blue mage is a square peg and FF XIV is a round hole. It's not going to fit in without remolding it. Look at red mage, it still 'can' heal but its healing capabilities are nerfed compared to many itterations to focus on making it primarily a damage dealer but with a touch of healing.

[PangTong]

The intention would be to keep things relatively simple to maintain balance and ease of understanding and use. Even if it was only a single skill which changed based on the enemy, and that skill was always just a damage oGCD ability with varying properties, that I think would still be a worthwhile way to incorporate the theme of learning abilities from your opponent, and give BLU its own niche in a highly homogenized game. Like, with the example of a single changing ability, in one case it might be a DoT, in another a big-hitting attack on a long cooldown, in another a small attack on a short cooldown, or a resource-building attack, or a resource-spending attack. It wouldn't be too hard to balance a set of skills such that their overall damage potential was about the same, and for an average player all they'd have to understand is to press the button, while still giving potential for more fine optimization of DPS for more attentive players.

[Starcake28]

I don't see that working out in a game with FF XIV's structure. Having blue mage's abilities react different say depending on if you're fighting Omega, Midgarsormr or Zenos could lead to the job becoming too complicated, too inconsistent to be used reliably in raid progression, or homogenizing them too much and making the system all flash no substance. A mechanic where they get hit and trigger some sort of ability may work, kind of like shield, but I don't see that functioning as more than a basic counter, and would only really work if they were made tanks.

You're right though that you can't really be consistently learning new abiltieis. They could incorporate learning abilities into the job story, but you won't be learning them throughout the expansion. And really, random outdoor mobs and even bosses don't really have abilities you could just give to players. Most normal enemies just have different shapes of generic aoe attacks to deal with. And special boss abilities wouldn't exactly translate well directly to a player. These can work fine in turn based games but not so much in ff xiv.

So I think really the best they could do is to keep the theme in tact. Have the lore be that they learn moves by studying monsters, and have their abilities themed after classic blue mage spells. But like so many other jobs, blue mage is going to need to see significant change to fit into the ARR onward mold. Summoner's the standout example though it got a bit closer with demi bahamut. But black mage also changed a lot, particularly with fire/blizard/lightning serving different purposes in the rotation rather than being the same spell with a different element and animation. DRK shed the sacrificing hp for damage aspect and became a tank. Ultimately, traditional blue mage is a square peg and FF XIV is a round hole. It's not going to fit in without remolding it. Look at red mage, it still 'can' heal but its healing capabilities are nerfed compared to many itterations to focus on making it primarily a damage dealer but with a touch of healing.

I believe thy going to make it where u look at your attacker thn dodge thn learn it because of fordola

[Starcake28]

If i had to say its abt balance just do this for traits if u put alot of damage up skills on your bar u get the 30% damage up but u lose 15% of your defense as a penalty also thy should do the spell thing like ff11 where u hve points like 24 some spells hve a 5 on thm some hve 3 8 6 10 if u put a 10 spell as 1 of the spells u want to use thn u hve 14 points left u also get a higher cap start at 15 thn 25 thn 30 as final cap cant remember wat the cap was in 11 but thy should keep tht ya blu has massive damage out but getting tht damage over everything else will hve a penalty cost tht's wat i thing thy should add for blue mage for Final fantasy 14 tht way ppl can't say blue mage Op if thy know wat i'm talking abt in 11 tht had hp -100 ot hp-500 as a penalty or hp -100 vit-5. And for blue story quest thy can just learn weapon skills and abilitys if u look back at Final fantasy 11 blue mage did hve a cap on spells thy only learned more spells as thy updated the game

[Bright-Flower]

I believe thy going to make it where u look at your attacker thn dodge thn learn it because of fordola

Fordola? If I remember right I don't think she was mimicing our skills but rather her Resonant artifical echo thing allowed her to read movements so well (or maybe it was very short range future sight) that allowed her to counter people easily, I don't think she was seeing spells and then copying them.

If i had to say its abt balance just do this for traits if u put alot of damage up skills on your bar u get the 30% damage up but u lose 15% of your defense as a penalty also thy should do the spell thing like ff11 where u hve points like 24 some spells hve a 5 on thm some hve 3 8 6 10 if u put a 10 spell as 1 of the spells u want to use thn u hve 14 points left u also get a higher cap start at 15 thn 25 thn 30 as final cap cant remember wat the cap was in 11 but thy should keep tht ya blu has massive damage out but getting tht damage over everything else will hve a penalty cost tht's wat i thing thy should add for blue mage for Final fantasy 14 tht way ppl can't say blue mage Op if thy know wat i'm talking abt in 11 tht had hp -100 ot hp-500 as a penalty or hp -100 vit-5. And for blue story quest thy can just learn weapon skills and abilitys if u look back at Final fantasy 11 blue mage did hve a cap on spells thy only learned more spells as thy updated the game

I really doubt anything like this is getting into FF XIV. Like it or hate it, FF XIV's job design just doesn't leave room for that level of customization or choice. They don't even let us choose cross role skills anymore and just give us all 10 before level 50.

[Starcake28]

We will see i hve a feeling its going to be close to FF11 blue mage because he knows ff11 players want blue mage in 14 to get more money and to shutdown ff11 this is the way to go money is everything to thm thn u think but thy not going to give u wat u think everytime as for dancer its not getting added in 5.0 srry to say