Thoughts on the Ascians so far?

[MetalSnakeXI1]

The thing with the Ascians, for me anyway, is that while we have learned a fair amount about them and their schemes, there's still a lot more that seems like we don't know. We don't know specifically what pertains to the resurrection of Zodiark, beyond the fact that it involves weakening Hydaelyn to initiate the "Rejoinings" by sowing the seeds of strife and chaos, primarily behind the scenes. This could "break the boundaries" that have apparently imprisoned Zodiark, certainly, but I think there's a lot more to it than that, as well as to what the true plans of the Ascians are. That said, i have a feeling these last couple patches of the current expansion are going to see the Ascians come into more prominence in the scope of the story, and I suspect they will finally be putting into action all the pieces on the board they've been carefully placing all this time.

As for completely destroying an Ascian, that remains a very difficult and potentially costly endeavor. The ones we already destroyed were careless and underestimated their opponents, which was a factor in their demise. We lost Moenbryda to finish off Nabrieles with her device that uses tremendous reserves of aether, and we got lucky to have appropriate tools in the form of Nidhogg's eyes in our/Thordan's possession to dispose of Igeyorhm and Lahabrea. I doubt that Elidibus and the remaining higher-ranking Ascians are going to be so reckless, and will be far more dangerous to deal with once they enact their plans in earnest.

I'm sure by now the other Ascians won't fall so easily for the Auracite trick again(and it's kinda ironic that Lahabrea was killed by the very thing he instructs people to summon....a primal xD)

So unless they're willing to make more sacrifices like what poor Moenbryda did,they gotta find another way to kill the ascians for good which is easier said than done cuz Thordan had to be both a primal and in possession of Nidhogg's eye to kill Lahabrea and that's already a ginormous amount of aether being in use here

[ObsidianFire]

There are different levels of Ascians and they take different amounts of aether to kill for good. You end up killing several black mask Ascians in the SMN quests with nothing but Deathflare, for instance (and by having them be away from dead bodies they can flee too.).

But the red mask Ascians are on another level, so...

[Kallera]

I'm sure by now the other Ascians won't fall so easily for the Auracite trick again(and it's kinda ironic that Lahabrea was killed by the very thing he instructs people to summon....a primal xD)

So unless they're willing to make more sacrifices like what poor Moenbryda did,they gotta find another way to kill the ascians for good which is easier said than done cuz Thordan had to be both a primal and in possession of Nidhogg's eye to kill Lahabrea and that's already a ginormous amount of aether being in use here

"Initiate Soul Extraction! HA! Success!"



I'd be cool if that was involved in some manner of slaying one by extracting it and putting it in something lethal.

[Ryaz]

The Ascians in my mind are overly melodramatic and hammy. That is all. The emperor was right in saying they're overly fond of their own voices.

But as others have said, I think a lot of people have just grown weary of them. They're playing the long game, which is fine, but there's so little variation in their characters that they get boring. There's only so many arrogant speeches you can take. It begins to feel really dragged out.

[Tizzy_Tormentor]

I want to take the Ascians seriously, but at the rate we just kick their asses over and over again, I would say they are about as threatening as Team Rocket, as in they show up, only to be smacked around a bit and leave, rinse and repeat.

Maybe they will go into them as much more of a threat in the coming story, but right now they just kind of seem like big bad wannabes.

[MistakeNot]

I want to take the Ascians seriously, but at the rate we just kick their asses over and over again, I would say they are about as threatening as Team Rocket, as in they show up, only to be smacked around a bit and leave, rinse and repeat.

Maybe they will go into them as much more of a threat in the coming story, but right now they just kind of seem like big bad wannabes.

Big bad wannabes who are behind most of the threats and problems we face....
Most of the primals in the game can be traced back to an Ascian teaching someone how to summon the primal. Including Bahamut himself, and thus by extension both the Fourth and Seventh Umbral Calamity.
Were we to look carefully I am sure we would find them to have been involved with many of the wars and disasters of the past.
In short, without the Ascians' meddling the story in the game would be very, very different.

The Ascians are a major threat, we just don't see much of what they do - only the results.

[Rosenoire]

The one main character death that I think would just hurl the WoL over the edge would be Y'sholta being killed since she's been around a lot and plays a rather large role in the overall story from 1.0 to 4.3 and 4.4 it seems. There's also Alphinaud.

Spoilers for 4.4:

When Thancred went down, I thought he would be it. He's changed an awful lot since we first met him, and unlike Papalymo and Lyse, he was integral to the plot. We've seen him change after his possession by Lahabrea and after losing his magic--which also makes him more expendable than Y'shtola, in a way.

[Iscah]

Spoilers for 4.4:

When Thancred went down, I thought he would be it. He's changed an awful lot since we first met him, and unlike Papalymo and Lyse, he was integral to the plot. We've seen him change after his possession by Lahabrea and after losing his magic--which also makes him more expendable than Y'shtola, in a way.

I don't think he's expendable until we get a bit more relevance out of his loss-of-magic - and until we get an explanation for what actually happened to his eye.

.............

[Lauront]

The Ascians are made to be such a big threat because they were so poorly understood for so long. For all we know Zodiark doesn't care about them at all and just needs agents because it's impossible for Him to act on His own (just like Hydaelyn).

I don't think that they should be downplayed as a big threat. They are one, both directly and in terms of the schemes they devise, some more capably than others, and they have brought down civilisations in the process, with Igeyorhm even having gone as far to plunge an entire world in darkness. All instances of the Overlords being defeated have been at the hands of the WoL (and his analogue on the First), with the blessing/aid of Hydaelyn and of course the Echo which he possesses, or similarly powerful entities, like Primals - and then, only due to circumstantial events that allowed the Primal in question to entrap the Ascian.

[Spoiler part below]

We've no idea how Gaius and his buddies did it, if they really did at all, but these are not your average mortal/adventurer, either.

I am also going to theorise that, being otherwordly entities, whose god is dormant/far away, we've not yet seen their full potential - thus far, my view is that their host might be the limiting factor of just how much aether they can channel. Still, even with mundane hosts, they can pull off impressive feats like the Ascian Prime. I'm eager to see how a tailor-made host like a certain Prince changes things.

[Spoiler part below]

I'm pretty sure that with the regular Ascians and even some of the Overlords, Zodiark has little bond, but things may differ with other Ascian Overlords, and particularly Elidibus. This new guy pretending to be "Solus" looks like he'll be fun, and I'm hoping he lives up to those Ardyn vibes.

There are different levels of Ascians and they take different amounts of aether to kill for good. You end up killing several black mask Ascians in the SMN quests with nothing but Deathflare, for instance (and by having them be away from dead bodies they can flee too.).

But the red mask Ascians are on another level, so...

I think we're glossing over something here - you kill them as the WoL, an individual blessed with the Echo in greater strength than usual, and with power garnered the lingering essence of a dead draconic primal, after a lengthy battle. It's not trivial stuff, much as Deathflare may seem to be from a mechanical POV. Compared to most mortals, you yourself in the game are closer to a demi-god.

I want to take the Ascians seriously, but at the rate we just kick their asses over and over again, I would say they are about as threatening as Team Rocket, as in they show up, only to be smacked around a bit and leave, rinse and repeat.

Maybe they will go into them as much more of a threat in the coming story, but right now they just kind of seem like big bad wannabes.

Plot device. Read above. It's not that simple. They certainly have already accomplished a great deal on this world alone.

I'm sure by now the other Ascians won't fall so easily for the Auracite trick again(and it's kinda ironic that Lahabrea was killed by the very thing he instructs people to summon....a primal xD)

So unless they're willing to make more sacrifices like what poor Moenbryda did,they gotta find another way to kill the ascians for good which is easier said than done cuz Thordan had to be both a primal and in possession of Nidhogg's eye to kill Lahabrea and that's already a ginormous amount of aether being in use here

I'm inclined to agree. They're adaptive and no doubt will have grown wise to our parlour tricks, one of which came at the cost of a Scion. Allagan trickery such as binding Primals or the Heart of Sabik will also be things they anticipate - because they taught them how to do all that. They're also why any attempts by the Eorzean Alliance to lean on primals will likely result in failure, besides serving their purposes. No, the primary threat to them is Hydaelyn and the WoL, through the strength she has bestowed upon him/her. But that is a deus-ex-machina and will probably only last as long as it takes for Zodiark to become more active - assuming he even is antagonistic towards us.

All that being said, I do want to see more from them. The drama is all part of it! I'm hoping the new guy delivers on it!

[Iscah]

Just a reminder that the original poster is only up to post-Heavensward and things we learned in 4.4 should only be talked about vaguely.